NL50: Flopped set. Protect vs slowplaying... - Page 2

CalledDownLight · #11 11-02-2007, 02:40 PM

I'd just bet the flop in hopes that he will raise or at least call.

AlexB182 · #12 11-02-2007, 02:44 PM

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did you plan to c/r? if so, how were you sure he was going to bet?
what was the plan if he was going to check behind? Villain was not very aggressive, he might've checked behind, right?

I think I prefer just betting out the flop.

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Take a look at the reads I included when I posted this hand please.

SammyG-SD · #13 11-02-2007, 02:49 PM

against this villian c/r is a good line, c/c can lead to a really bad spot. I do think a lead is a good play also, with his stats, we have a good chance he could come over the top. It depends on how much cbeting you were doing. I like to take the same line here that I would with AK

CalledDownLight · #14 11-02-2007, 02:50 PM

I don't get why we have to c/r here. This guy is never ever folding any pair or any draw on the flop. Just cbet.

Ulkis · #15 11-02-2007, 02:56 PM

Sorry Alex, my bad, missed the read.

I still bet out.

AlexB182 · #16 11-02-2007, 03:01 PM

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Sorry Alex, my bad, missed the read.

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NP.

Brimstead · #17 11-02-2007, 03:16 PM

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I don't get why we have to c/r here. This guy is never ever folding any pair or any draw on the flop. Just cbet.

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yeah, i dont like checking my monsters if i would usually cbet. I would hope he raises then we can 3bet.

AlexB182 · #18 11-02-2007, 03:20 PM

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I don't get why we have to c/r here. This guy is never ever folding any pair or any draw on the flop. Just cbet.

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yeah, i dont like checking my monsters if i would usually cbet. I would hope he raises then we can 3bet.

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That's what I did not like about it too, because I usually have a very high CB percentage so I pretty much have to also play my big hands from up front...

GermanGuy · #19 11-02-2007, 06:53 PM

Let me grunch here.

I think your play is good, but not for the reason you gave. The amount you raise does not deny him the odds to draw to his OESD or flush. He has to call 8.25 and the pot is around 24 and some cents after rake. This gives him odds of three to one. In other words he only has to make 8 bucks on the turn for calling to be +EV. Are you really going to fold this when the 5 [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] hits (just an example that would complete one of the numerous draws).

If you wanted to get him of this draw you would have to bet bigger (lets say 17$, that we he would have to get at least 22$ after the turn to make a call profitable, which you could fold more easily).

But it is okay to make him call. First of all if he doesn't have a draw but a small made hand, like a pair or two, he could call given your description of him. This depends a little on whether the size of his raise is typical too, if it is unusually big, he is even more likely to not have a drawing hand.

If he has the draw he will call correctly but then it is important how much he will bet on the turn. Let's assume the worst. A scare card comes and you check to him. He will have to bet around 15-20 bucks to make you pay of for his flop investment. His effective stack will still be around 45-50 afterwards. So you can profitably call for your outs to a full house. The other option is to lead the turn yourself. This is your obvious play with a safe card, but you can also do it with a scare card, that depends on whether you think he might fold (its a scare card for him too if he doesn't have the nut flush).

I would lead the turn with around 25. That way you can get some better hands to fold (if he still hasnn't improved he won't continue anyway) and you will have odds to call a shove (around 40 to a possible win of 130) because he might do this while bluffing. In fact I think it's best if you raise slightly more, maybe around 15, to decrease the necessary size of that turn bet.

toymach776 · #20 11-03-2007, 01:24 AM

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I don't get why we have to c/r here. This guy is never ever folding any pair or any draw on the flop. Just cbet.

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We dont HAVE to c/r but I think it is an excellent line against this particular villain. Alex says that he will bet almost any time that he is checked too and I am assuming whether he has a hand or not (he cant have a hand every time hes checked to). If villain has air, then he will probably still bet and we can get at least some value out of our set by letting him be the aggressor and then c/r'ing him. He will fold air that he would probably also have folded if we cbet. If he has a draw then our c/r gets more money in the pot when he bets. We then c/r enough to kill his draw odds and if he still calls thats great. If he has a strong hand that we beat then we are getting a lot of money in the pot and maybe even hopefully getting it all in on the flop before a scare card comes either for us or for him and slows down the action. I dont always like a c/r line with a flopped set but here I think its a good spot to do so.