God helped Jerry Yang win WSOP! - Page 6

vhawk01 · #51 10-15-2007, 01:22 PM

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Joyce says. "But more important than that, we learned a priceless lesson: If you do what is right, God takes care of you."

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This really bothers me, because it reflects a bias that is present in our culture: "Good things happen to good people and bad things happen to bad people." This is a real bias and studies have been done showing this. Therefore when bad things happen to other people there is an unfair (unless you agree with Joyce) bias toward thinking that they deserved it.

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This may not be a true bias. Good and bad seem to hit everyone. Its just people take comfort in saying this.

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Its a true bias. It isn't even an incorrect bias, qualitatively speaking. I would be willing to bet that, all else being equal, good people have more success in their lives than bad people (good and bad defined by some consensus survey on what traits each has, I don't really care what the definition is). Where the bias comes in is that most people VASTLY overestimate this correlation. Good things happen to good people more often, but bad things happen to good people A WHOLE LOT. Just slightly less than to bad people. So much so that its nearly useless to try and use one thing (goodness of people or goodness of result) to guess at the other. THAT is where the bias comes in, how strongly people think this correlation is.

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Well its pretty hard to quantify this...You do have the peer groups people hang out in and environment playing major roles. Plus everyone's bias/perception will vary and how could you ever measure it unless you conducted some kind of worldwide census...even then regional views are bound to affect the results and who's to say they shouldn't you are trying to determine the scope of the bias and underlying reasons for it. A lot of people do like to use that karma phrase "what goes around comes around" in the West not sure about other parts of the world.

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Yeah I think they do research and everything! Maybe even use a calculator or a stopwatch or something.

Silent A · #52 10-15-2007, 01:22 PM

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Seriously man, you should really drop the "tested" stuff pronto. It makes your already mostly ridiculous position totally absurd and untenable. Using your approach, how do we know God isn't a flamboyant gay and he put the homoslaying in the OT as a big test for all of us?

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Because it's not meant to be a serious philosophical argument but a post hoc rationalization of why the world as it exists doesn't fit with their ideas about the fundamentally benevolent nature of their god.

vhawk01 · #53 10-15-2007, 01:24 PM

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Seriously man, you should really drop the "tested" stuff pronto. It makes your already mostly ridiculous position totally absurd and untenable. Using your approach, how do we know God isn't a flamboyant gay and he put the homoslaying in the OT as a big test for all of us?

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Because it's not meant to be a serious philosophical argument but a post hoc rationalization of why the world as it exists doesn't fit with their ideas about the fundamentally benevolent nature of their god.

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Yeah but still...you guys are missing the part where he says you cannot tell just by looking at the situation whether God is cursing anyone...but hey it sure SEEMS like he is blessing people, huh!?!?!

Splendour · #54 10-15-2007, 01:24 PM

People have personal relationships with God...Even Eastern religions describe a third eye...How do we know there isn't a Christian version of the third eye. The bible probably describes it by another name...Maybe (emphasis on maybe) some Christian people have more fully developed third eyes than others...This could be a gift...the way some people have a facility for languages, or math, or the arts, or writing, or science. Why is it some people take to religion like a duck to water while others don't. Why is it some people can master math while others struggle continuously?

tpir · #55 10-15-2007, 01:33 PM

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Seriously man, you should really drop the "tested" stuff pronto. It makes your already mostly ridiculous position totally absurd and untenable. Using your approach, how do we know God isn't a flamboyant gay and he put the homoslaying in the OT as a big test for all of us?

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Because it's not meant to be a serious philosophical argument but a post hoc rationalization of why the world as it exists doesn't fit with their ideas about the fundamentally benevolent nature of their god.

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Well sure. I understand why people take this line, but it's important to hammer on why it's a worthless one to even consider. No need for Bible quotes or arguing through 5 pages of faith conflation on this one. Straight up reason vs. non-reason. So, what do theists have against reason?

vhawk01 · #56 10-15-2007, 01:37 PM

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People have personal relationships with God...Even Eastern religions describe a third eye...How do we know there isn't a Christian version of the third eye. The bible probably describes it by another name...Maybe (emphasis on maybe) some Christian people have more fully developed third eyes than others...This could be a gift...the way some people have a facility for languages, or math, or the arts, or writing, or science. Why is it some people take to religion like a duck to water while others don't. Why is it some people can master math while others struggle continuously?

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I have no idea what this is in reference to, but it seems to be a distraction. Could you maybe clear up a little bit how you can tell by looking at something that it is a result of God's blessing (or at least LIKELY to be a result of God's blessing) but at the very same time you cannot look at something and decide it is likely to be a result of God's cursing? They seem to be two sides of the same coin. If the WSOP was God blessing Jerry, then surely the WSOP was God cursing me. I like that explanation better than "I suck at poker" anyhow.

tpir · #57 10-15-2007, 01:48 PM

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People have personal relationships with God...Even Eastern religions describe a third eye...How do we know there isn't a Christian version of the third eye. The bible probably describes it by another name...Maybe (emphasis on maybe) some Christian people have more fully developed third eyes than others...This could be a gift...the way some people have a facility for languages, or math, or the arts, or writing, or science. Why is it some people take to religion like a duck to water while others don't. Why is it some people can master math while others struggle continuously?

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wtf.

One of the best dodge attempts I have seen in a long time. Confusing and thought-provoking, yet, utterly pointless.

Splendour, every time I read your posts I think of this Cornell study about incompetence and how the participants were too incompetent to even realize why their wrong answers are terrible:

http://www.apa.org/journals/features/psp7761121.pdf

Good read if you have the time.

kurto · #58 10-15-2007, 02:18 PM

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People have personal relationships with God...Even Eastern religions describe a third eye...How do we know there isn't a Christian version of the third eye. The bible probably describes it by another name...Maybe (emphasis on maybe) some Christian people have more fully developed third eyes than others...This could be a gift...the way some people have a facility for languages, or math, or the arts, or writing, or science. Why is it some people take to religion like a duck to water while others don't. Why is it some people can master math while others struggle continuously?

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Wow. That's a lot of deep stuff to consider there. Maybe there's some Christian third eye and it just isn't called that or mentioned anywhere. (emphasis on Maybe) Its worthwhile to consider that maybe some Christians have this unmentioned and unnamed gift. What this third eye does, how it benefits these Christians and why no one's bothered to mention it before you is all trivial details.

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Why is it some people take to religion like a duck to water while others don't.

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I don't think you would like a lot of the answers to this. Perhaps its just as important to ask why some people take to astrology like a duck to water while others don't?

Is 'taking to religion' even a good trait? Does it matter what religion? What are you saying?

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Why is it some people can master math while others struggle continuously?

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What does this have to do with a third eye? Are you in the same thread as everyone else?

kurto · #59 10-15-2007, 02:24 PM

Thanks for posting that study. Will read on train home tonight.

The opening paragraph spoke true. Not only do I find that those who have no understanding of basic logical syllagisms are the ones most certain that there thinking is sound and unimpeachable.

I suspect this could be cross posted in the poker forums too. It would explain a lot of plays at the tables.

tpir · #60 10-15-2007, 02:32 PM

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Thanks for posting that study. Will read on train home tonight.

The opening paragraph spoke true. Not only do I find that those who have no understanding of basic logical syllagisms are the ones most certain that there thinking is sound and unimpeachable.

I suspect this could be cross posted in the poker forums too. It would explain a lot of plays at the tables.

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I have decided that this study combined with some-study-I-have-never-read-but-probably-exists on people being biased towards tribalism explains like 99% of human activities period.