tough turn spot w/ small str8 vs tournament professional

[ahnuld]

im not sure how Hellmuth plays cash other than bad, but if he plays similar to tournies, which I suspect, he wouldnt be 3 betting TTT or two pair or a combo draw on this turn. He seems to love outplaying his opponent and leaving all the main decision for the river so that leads me to think he would be calling trips and two pairs and combo draws when you CR instead of 3 betting them. So this makes me think he has air or nothing, but given your lack of CRing so far, it would be a really really stupid spot to 4 bet with air or one pair as a total bluff. I think i can let this go.

[ahnuld]

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im sorry, were you actually considering folding? the only better spot than this is probably ariel in a chinese game

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AHAHAHA.

but seriously stass, does he run bad or does he suck? Empirical evidence points to the latter.

[ahnuld]

man, just saw Dean.'s post in BBV about hellmuth cash game stlye. He just flat out sucks and this is a push.

[idrinktoomuch]

I think you should answer you phone calls from your friend w/ the same name who used to be BUSTO but is far from it now and LITERALLY lives right around the corner from you

[im a model]

i would call. and i am the alpha and the omega. but what i really want to know is, so what happened yo?

[xxThe_Lebowskixx]

how are you even considering folding?

[ebarnet]

Really feel like he's making this small raise to just get a free showdown if a blank rolls off, and for pot control if an action card hits. Makes me lean towards 9T or JT, he's gotta raise flop w/ a set *unless he has 99*. Shoving's going to be very profitable here, i think he's calling with worse considering how drawy this board is.

[Ship Ship McGipp]

i initially said insta stack off, but ahnuld kind of put me onthe fence bc i know about phil's play and i agree with his assessment.

that said, if this is a nuts air spot for him... is this a call and check call river or are there too many gay cards and we should just be getting it in even if he rarely calls with worse

[xxThe_Lebowskixx]

i have no idea how ph plays and i dont see how this is ever nuts/air in a hu 100bb ring game.

[Ship Ship McGipp]

[ QUOTE ]

im not sure how Hellmuth plays cash other than bad, but if he plays similar to tournies, which I suspect, he wouldnt be 3 betting TTT or two pair or a combo draw on this turn.

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i have a friend taht played 12 hours with him in monte carlo and said almost this exact thing. he said phil waited to the river to get money in without the stone cold nuts. i.e. he flops top set on T 8 7 and keeps getting bet into, flat calling. finally river and turn brick and the guy checks and he puts a small retardo value bet out, and makes a comment about how the guy actually convinced him he flopped a straight by leading into him so strong. another example he check calls two streets with a straight flush draws misses and shows.

from all accounts phil likes to wait until he's got the stone cold nuts and play passively, especially in position.

i really don't see how he ever shows up with pair + sd or pair + fd tbh, or even any two pair- maaaaaaaybe a set, or much more likely J7 or QJ, or total random "you can't CR my float easily" bull [censored].

that's just my read from what i've heard, coupled with what ahnuld said and i agreed with.

p.s. i would almost be positive that phil does not necessarily distinguish between touranments and cash games; which is what makes him so bad at cash and early on with a lot of bbs in tournaments.