AA slowplay pf

[Marshall28]

Full Tilt Poker
$0.25/$0.50 No Limit Hold'em Ring Game
5 Players
LegoPoker Hand Converter

<font color="black">Stack Sizes</font>
Hero (BTN): $77.15
SB: $35.45
BB: $16.1
UTG: $55.30
CO: $32.70

<font color="black">Preflop:</font> A[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] A[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] ($0.75, 5 players)
<font color="red">UTG raises to $1.75</font>, CO folds, Hero calls $1.75, <font color="red">SB raises to $5</font>, BB folds, UTG folds, Hero calls $3.25

<font color="black">Flop:</font> K[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] 3[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 8[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] ($12.25, 2 players)
SB checks, <font color="red">Hero bets $8</font>, SB calls $8

<font color="black">Turn:</font> K[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] 3[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 8[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] [2[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]] ($28.25, 2 players)
SB checks, Hero checks

<font color="black">River:</font> K[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] 3[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 8[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 2[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] [6[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]] ($28.25, 2 players)
<font color="red">SB bets $15</font>, <font color="red">Hero raises to $30</font>, SB calls all in for $7.70
Uncalled bet of $7.30 returned to Hero

okay so, the reason i flat called the aces to the initial raise is that i was reading an article in cardplayer earlier today where someone was saying that he doesnt like to 3bet a UTG raiser because it basically tells everyone that you have a huge hand. so i was experimenting a bit with flatting UTG raises w/ hands id generally 3bet.

anyways .. .then i got squeezed. i thought, well, a raise at this point turns my hand even more face up so i thought id take a flop...

im kinda inexperienced with dealing with these types of situations because i really have never tried to do anytihng like this before. how do u guys like to play after the flop in these types of spots?

i really thought something was fishy when he checked the flop, think maybe my bet there is probably a mistake. obviously shoving on river though, my hand is too undefined and he calls with much worse im sure.

[mvdgaag]

he had KK?

It is not always a good idea not to 3bet. Many flops will kill the action or you'll have a hard time laying it down when you might be beat. You'll win a small pot if the flop doesn't hit them, but are quite likely to lose a big one if they do.

Instead you could 3bet light more often, esp with suited connectors (since they do well against big pairs). This will not only conceil your 3bet big hands, but also allows you to get action with them against worse hands.

GL

[disk189]

i don't like to play games in uNL. that's why I wouldn't experiment. i would've played same on flop bet on turn and river, even if its small.
but wait for more advice i'm a donk

[Marshall28]

thx for telling me things i already know ....

if someone would like to take a second and think outside the box and give me a real response, itd be appreciated.

[disk189]

after reviewing this hand once again is this SB a very tight player? It is awkward for him to raise to 5 in this position for me unless he has a big hand... big hands like KK-JJ or maybe even AK. In that range the only hand that can beat you is KK. I think by checking on the turn you allowed him to take control of the hand. SB seems to be aggressive enough to put out a re-raise on pre-flop so i just don't see him slowplaying by checking on two streets. Instead of checking on the turn I would make a bet... not too big maybe 10 dollars
just to test out the waters a bit more
If i was playing the hand I would thing his river raise is because he knows that you checked... i guess.
my interpretation.

[Gelford]

[ QUOTE ]
thx for telling me things i already know ....

if someone would like to take a second and think outside the box and give me a real response, itd be appreciated.

[/ QUOTE ]

uNL is not for outside the box, but if you explain your reasoning I am willing to discuss. IMHO you could have missed a lot of value in this hand and left half a stack on the table.

[haz31]

There are 2 easy parts to this.

Firstly cardplayer normally talks about full ring and not 6max which are very different UTG's

Secondly and more importantly

You say that when you 3bet an UTG raiser everyone thinks u have a big hand? If you trully believe this, then the solution is NOT to stop 3betting UTG raises with AA, but rather to exploit this by 3betting much less premium hands against UTG raisers.
This forces them to either play back at you, at which time you go back to a tighter UTG 3 bet range, or they let you run over them.

This is pretty much 6max poker 101

[Gelford]

[ QUOTE ]
There are 2 easy parts to this.

Firstly cardplayer normally talks about full ring and not 6max which are very different UTG's

Secondly and more importantly

You say that when you 3bet an UTG raiser everyone thinks u have a big hand? If you trully believe this, then the solution is NOT to stop 3betting UTG raises with AA, but rather to exploit this by 3betting much less premium hands against UTG raisers.
This forces them to either play back at you, at which time you go back to a tighter UTG 3 bet range, or they let you run over them.

This is pretty much 6max poker 101

[/ QUOTE ]


Nice responce ... funny enough poker is a bit counter intuitive when it comes to these matters. Often the best action is not to hold back, but to open up.

[Bonesy]

I guess Q38 would have been better but this flop is pretty great for what you are trying to do. Frankly I like the way the hand was played. I know I'm in the minority here but I'm also sick of 3betting an UTG raiser only to see him fold. Versus a donk, I reraise preflop every time. Getting squeezed was even better since his hand is pretty defined. It sucks running into KK but you were losing anyways if you got it all in pf. I just don't think your play is wrong if done at the right times.

[Marshall28]

[ QUOTE ]
There are 2 easy parts to this.

Firstly cardplayer normally talks about full ring and not 6max which are very different UTG's

Secondly and more importantly

You say that when you 3bet an UTG raiser everyone thinks u have a big hand? If you trully believe this, then the solution is NOT to stop 3betting UTG raises with AA, but rather to exploit this by 3betting much less premium hands against UTG raisers.
This forces them to either play back at you, at which time you go back to a tighter UTG 3 bet range, or they let you run over them.

This is pretty much 6max poker 101

[/ QUOTE ]

haz, good points, however I think you may be overlooking something.... the whole fact that the original raiser is UTG gives us the problem that he is for the most part only goign to be raising fairly premium hands ...

if we start 3betting a UTG raiser with much more marginal hands we are going to be putting ourselves in very tough spots against very strong hands.