TPGK w/a lot of action

[ssmallz]

UTG limps, he's a 44/12 pretty bad player, I complete the sb w/KsTh, bb checks. BB is JunkFisher, a multitabling tag who seems pretty strait foward and doesn't get out of line too much. We see the flop 3ways

Flop Td6h3h

I check, bb checks, fish bets I c/r, bb 3 bombs, fish calls 2 cold, I call.

Turn Qs

I bet bb raises, fish folds, I call intending to c/f if I don't improve on the river.

My thinking: BBs check 3 bet could mean a few things from flopped set, to strait draw or flush draw, or even TPTK. Since my hand isn't that strong 4 betting and leading didn't seem like the right play and a lot of turn cards can change things. On the turn the Qs seems like a relative blank so I could donk it and see how they react. Once BB raises I'm fairly sure I'm behind. Since he got a free look from the bb its kinda tough for me to put him on a hand since he can have any 2 pair or set.

Thoughts, comments, alternative lines welcome

[mjkidd]

I'd just check call the turn and the river. Your hand might be good, but it's not strong enough to be worth protecting. The BB is almost certainly betting here, so you're not risking a free card.

[YertleTurtle]

Why not iso-raise preflop? I think this hand plays much easier you take the initiative and you may get BB to fold preflop.

YT

[admiralfluff]

I raise preflop, and c/c the turn, c/c river. He's not taking a free card often enough to make a turn bet worth it imo.

[ssmallz]

[ QUOTE ]
Why not iso-raise preflop? I think this hand plays much easier you take the initiative and you may get BB to fold preflop.

YT

[/ QUOTE ]

It's something I was thinking about but I hate playing OOP when I miss. I never feel comfortable and I didn't think KTo was strong enough. Usually I'll raise ATo but when I miss, I hate myself for it. It's an area of my game I def need to improve

[surfdoc]

I don't like the turn donk. His check/3 bet is strong enough that you are beat here much more often than you are getting free carded by a flush draw. Just check and decide. When the fish takes two more to the mandible you may be up against a monster as well and if the turn gets bet and raised you get away cheap. Having him in will also serve some purpose to pad the pot and keep Junkfisher's action even more straightforward than usual.

[surfdoc]

I thought about this one a bit more and I think that if you are going to bet you need to fold to a raise against this player. How many outs do you estimate you have?

[Hoi Polloi]

[ QUOTE ]
I thought about this one a bit more and I think that if you are going to bet you need to fold to a raise against this player. How many outs do you estimate you have?

[/ QUOTE ]

I think both of Surfdoc's comments are spot on. If you're going to showdown, make it as cheap as possible. If you bet the turn, you have to be able to fold to raise; otherwise, what are you expecting the bet to accomplish?

As for pre-flop, it is always best with a hand like this and an opponent like this to get it heads up. Sometimes you miss. That's why they invented folding.

[ssmallz]

[ QUOTE ]
I thought about this one a bit more and I think that if you are going to bet you need to fold to a raise against this player. How many outs do you estimate you have?

[/ QUOTE ]

I feel like he's got 2 pair here often enough to the point where I can call to see the river and having odds to do so.

[ssmallz]

[ QUOTE ]

As for pre-flop, it is always best with a hand like this and an opponent like this to get it heads up. Sometimes you miss. That's why they invented folding.

[/ QUOTE ]

How low do you go in terms or raising big offsuits oop? K9o? QTo? I know that have the best hand here a good % of the time but do we really have enough equity to push? Our hand isn't spectacular, bb could wake up w/a real hand, and utg is calling our bet 100% of the time with position. Whatever equity we have pf will probably be lost by the fact that we have to play oop against 1 possibly 2 opponents