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#1
10-13-2006, 09:29 AM
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15/30 live overpair gets donked into twice
Again, I don't play much limit so if this is dumb, let me know why.
9-handed 15/30 at the Bellagio. Overall the game is pretty passive, with few streets ever getting 3bet (or more). BB is tight-weird in that he doesn't play many hands (and has never 3bet preflop but has shown down AK twice as a cold caller) but takes some odd lines postflop, checking in spots where I think he should clearly bet and betting in some spots where I think he should clearly check/call or check/fold. Button is kind of wild preflop (plays a lot of hands even for a raise and 3-/4-bets pretty light) and on the flop but turns into a gigantic wimp on the expensive streets. His calls and raises on the flop are a huge range of hands but he'll often check through or fold the turn and/or river when he's still around for those streets. 2 folds, I raise KK, folded to button who calls, SB folds BB calls. Flop T72r BB bets, I raise, button calls, BB calls Turn T (now 2 clubs, I don't have the Kc) BB bets, I call with the intention of folding to a single raise from button regardless of if BB comes along and calling one more bet on the river (unless it's a king of course) but not any more than that. Does this plan suck? 
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#3
10-13-2006, 02:07 PM
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Re: 15/30 live overpair gets donked into twice
I'll take a stab at this.
Given your read on the BB--he's tight PF and never 3-bets, and plays Opposite Man post-flop--I think we're probably still ahead on the turn slightly more often than we're behind because he could be jabbing at you w/Q-Q, J-J, 9-9, 8-9 or a flush draw. So, you should raise the turn for value and to kick the button out to protect your hand.
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#4
10-13-2006, 02:27 PM
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Re: 15/30 live overpair gets donked into twice
[ QUOTE ]
Again, I don't play much limit so if this is dumb, let me know why. 9-handed 15/30 at the Bellagio. Overall the game is pretty passive, with few streets ever getting 3bet (or more). BB is tight-weird in that he doesn't play many hands (and has never 3bet preflop but has shown down AK twice as a cold caller) but takes some odd lines postflop, checking in spots where I think he should clearly bet and betting in some spots where I think he should clearly check/call or check/fold. Button is kind of wild preflop (plays a lot of hands even for a raise and 3-/4-bets pretty light) and on the flop but turns into a gigantic wimp on the expensive streets. His calls and raises on the flop are a huge range of hands but he'll often check through or fold the turn and/or river when he's still around for those streets. 2 folds, I raise KK, folded to button who calls, SB folds BB calls. Flop T72r BB bets, I raise, button calls, BB calls Turn T (now 2 clubs, I don't have the Kc) BB bets, I call with the intention of folding to a single raise from button regardless of if BB comes along and calling one more bet on the river (unless it's a king of course) but not any more than that. Does this plan suck? [/ QUOTE ] good observations about the table... re: your plan: that's good that you have a plan, often times i don't i confess...My default strategy on the turn is to raise a bet if i have better than top pair top kicker, and if re-raised then think a lot about what to do...
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#5
10-13-2006, 03:20 PM
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Re: 15/30 live overpair gets donked into twice
[ QUOTE ]
I'll take a stab at this. Given your read on the BB--he's tight PF and never 3-bets, and plays Opposite Man post-flop--I think we're probably still ahead on the turn slightly more often than we're behind because he could be jabbing at you w/Q-Q, J-J, 9-9, 8-9 or a flush draw. So, you should raise the turn for value and to kick the button out to protect your hand. [/ QUOTE ] What am I protecting my hand from with a raise? This board is super-dry (98 is the only reasonable draw on the flop and there's only one pair that could've picked up a flush draw on the turn) so raising to protect my hand seems less important than holding some bets back in the event somebody has a ten. Raising and folding to a 3bet (from either player) sounds like a good idea but I don't know if I could ever actually do it, especially if button coldcalled two and BB 3bet so I'm getting 10:1 on that call and (probably) 13:1 on a river call to showdown my overpair. Folding reasonable hands on the later streets in limit seems very difficult to me as you are usually getting fantastic odds to snap off a bluff/misclick/retarded value bet from a worse hand.
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#6
10-13-2006, 03:53 PM
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Re: 15/30 live overpair gets donked into twice
[ QUOTE ]
Folding reasonable hands on the later streets in limit seems very difficult to me as you are usually getting fantastic odds to snap off a bluff/misclick/retarded value bet from a worse hand. [/ QUOTE ] IMO this is MUCH more true on the river than the turn because of the threat of future action. If BB wasn't opposite man post flop I think I can fold my Kings here and feel good about it because you are almost always paying 2 big bets to find out your kings are no good here. Just as an aside do you often snap off misclicks live? [img]/images/graemlins/wink.gif[/img]
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