|
|
#31
07-02-2007, 10:33 PM
|
|||
|
|||
Re: Bush to commute Libby sentence
[ QUOTE ]
You dodged the question I asked you as it can be answered with a simple yes or a no. I'll take your non answer as a no you don't think Armitage committed a crime. [/ QUOTE ] The question is almost irrelevant. You propping it up as relevant is the same right-wing canard that attempts to claim Plame wasn't convert. As for what I think, I'm inclined to believe that Armitage didn't commit any crime. I suspect Fitzgerald decided not to prosecute Armitage because he accepted Armitage's claim that he didn't know Plame was a covert operative. According to all reports, Armitage was cooperative during the whole investigation, so he didn't lie to federal investigators or the grand jury, hence why he wasn't charged with anything -- unlike Libby, who did lie to investigators and the grand jury. 
|
|
#32
07-02-2007, 10:46 PM
|
|||
|
|||
|
Re: Bush to commute Libby sentence
I am inclined to believe that Fitzgerald believes that Dick Cheney is guilty of something but was unable to prove it in part because of Libby's lying.
|
|
#33
07-02-2007, 10:48 PM
|
|||
|
|||
|
Re: Bush to commute Libby sentence
[ QUOTE ]
I am inclined to believe that Fitzgerald believes that Dick Cheney is guilty of something but was unable to prove it in part because of Libby's lying. [/ QUOTE ] I think there were a couple of jurors who noted after the case that they shared the same suspicion.
|
|
#34
07-02-2007, 10:50 PM
|
|||
|
|||
|
Re: Bush to commute Libby sentence
First of all, who cares if there was an original crime or not? Lying under oath is perjury- there is no "except when some people believe there was no underlying crime."
But, let's go with that argument. The Bush appointed USA said there was an underlying crime. The Bush appointed Judge handling the case agreed, and ripped Libby a new one about it. The GOP judges hearing Libby's appeal also agreed. Just ten years ago, lying under oath in a matter where there was no 'underlying crime,' was considered to be at the level of high crimes and misdemeanors and was enough to impeach a president. Oh, yeah. A DEMOCRATIC president. I forgot laws don't apply to republicans.
|
|
#35
07-02-2007, 10:52 PM
|
|||
|
|||
|
Re: Bush to commute Libby sentence
[ QUOTE ]
I am inclined to believe that Fitzgerald believes that Dick Cheney is guilty of something but was unable to prove it in part because of Libby's lying. [/ QUOTE ] Yes, so? That has nothing to do with whether or not Libby lied under oath, of which there is no doubt.
|
|
#36
07-02-2007, 11:42 PM
|
|||
|
|||
|
Re: Bush to commute Libby sentence
[ QUOTE ]
Bush will go down as the ______________ president ever... [/ QUOTE ] Great, or greatest?
|
|
#37
07-02-2007, 11:54 PM
|
|||
|
|||
|
Re: Bush to commute Libby sentence
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] You dodged the question I asked you as it can be answered with a simple yes or a no. I'll take your non answer as a no you don't think Armitage committed a crime. [/ QUOTE ] The question is almost irrelevant. You propping it up as relevant is the same right-wing canard that attempts to claim Plame wasn't convert. [/ QUOTE ] As for what I think, I'm inclined to believe that Armitage didn't commit any crime. I suspect Fitzgerald decided not to prosecute Armitage because he accepted Armitage's claim that he didn't know Plame was a covert operative. According to all reports, Armitage was cooperative during the whole investigation, so he didn't lie to federal investigators or the grand jury, hence why he wasn't charged with anything -- unlike Libby, who did lie to investigators and the grand jury. [/ QUOTE ] I had a long answer to this but alas it took too long to enter and I don't have the motivation to do it again. I'll just say that I believe the alleged crime that triggered the investigation is very relevant and that the finding that no crime was committed at the very beginning of the investigation is also very relevent. I realize that Fitzgerald had the investigative powers in being appointed a special prosecuter but I have a major problem with the government conducting investigations in this way. I've also gone on record many times on this forum in criticising the Starr investigation of Clinton. I find it ironic that those people who support the idea that lying before a grand jury under all circumstances is wrong when condemning Libby. I'm fairly certain many of them were screaming about the Starr investigation of Clinton. Also I'd like to see them go before a grand jury and give testimonry for eight hours about anything a prosecuter wanted to question them about and see if that prosecuter could trip them up. Anyway we could debate the merits of the case against Libby ad infinutem. The governments case against Libby claimed that he lied as to where he learned the identity of Valerie Plame from. Libby claimed he learned it from reporters and the government claimed he learned it from government sources. Here's a link to a Chicago Tribune story claiming that you could find out everything you wanted to know about Valerie Plane working for the CIA on the internet for crying out loud. Internet Blows CIA Cover She is 52 years old, married, grew up in the Kansas City suburbs and now lives in Virginia, in a new three-bedroom house. Anyone who can qualify for a subscription to one of the online services that compile public information also can learn that she is a CIA employee who, over the past decade, has been assigned to several American embassies in Europe. The CIA asked the Tribune not to publish her name because she is a covert operative, and the newspaper agreed. But unbeknown to the CIA, her affiliation and those of hundreds of men and women like her have somehow become a matter of public record, thanks to the Internet. When the Tribune searched a commercial online data service, the result was a virtual directory of more than 2,600 CIA employees, 50 internal agency telephone numbers and the locations of some two dozen secret CIA facilities around the United States. IMO Fitzgerald had no reason to continue the investigation after he knew that Armitage was the source of the leak and he determined that he didn't have a case. Hope I didn't take too long writing this answer because I'm not motivated to write it another one to your post. Libby Grand Jury Testimony Summary Full Transcript
|
|
#38
07-02-2007, 11:55 PM
|
|||
|
|||
|
Re: Bush to commute Libby sentence
[ QUOTE ]
First of all, who cares if there was an original crime or not? Lying under oath is perjury- there is no "except when some people believe there was no underlying crime." But, let's go with that argument. The Bush appointed USA said there was an underlying crime. The Bush appointed Judge handling the case agreed, and ripped Libby a new one about it. The GOP judges hearing Libby's appeal also agreed. Just ten years ago, lying under oath in a matter where there was no 'underlying crime,' was considered to be at the level of high crimes and misdemeanors and was enough to impeach a president. Oh, yeah. A DEMOCRATIC president. I forgot laws don't apply to republicans. [/ QUOTE ] So you're fine with the Star investigation of Clinton. I'm not.
|
|
#39
07-03-2007, 12:00 AM
|
|||
|
|||
|
Re: Bush to commute Libby sentence
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] Bush will go down as the ______________ president ever... [/ QUOTE ] Great, or greatest? [/ QUOTE ] lol beat me to it.
|
|
#40
07-03-2007, 12:38 AM
|
|||
|
|||
|
Huh?
[ QUOTE ]
I thought I read that Armitage wasn't charged because Libby's actions rendered it basically impossible to charge him with a crime. [/ QUOTE ] <slapping head with disbelief that someone could state this> Armitage hates Bush.... He is in no way a supporter of Bush. Fitzfong knew that Armitage leaked Plame's identity to Novak from day-1 of the investigation. Source: Novak himself. Armitage got a free pass from the Dems and Fitzfong because he was anti-Bush. No one with a rational mind could claim this prosecution of Libby was non-partisan while Armitage gets to walk without any consequences.... It was Armitage's BIG MOUTH which started this entire episode....
|
 |
|
|
Linear Mode
