NL10 - Combo draw. Go to felt?

You're No Daisy · #1 10-08-2007, 11:03 PM

Villain is 82/23/2.35 over 134 hands. Calls every raise OOP and donk bets every flop. He has done this to me 4 times over our session and I knew he either had nothing or any piece of the board (bottom, middle, or top pair for example). However, I had nothing either so I had to fold.

On this particular hand, I had a combo draw and planned on going to the felt with it against this particular villain. But what if we were playing against a TAG who was 20/15? Are we taking the same line?

Ultimate Bet No-Limit Hold'em, $.10 BB (5 handed) Hand History Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com (Format: 2+2 Forums)

UTG ($19.91)
MP ($7.49)
Hero ($11.26)
SB ($10.40)
BB ($5.09)

Preflop: Hero is Button with 6[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], A[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img].
UTG raises to $0.35, 1 fold, Hero calls $0.35, 2 folds.

Flop: ($0.85) 5[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], 7[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], 4[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (2 players)
UTG bets $0.85, Hero raises to $2.55, UTG raises to $4.25, Hero goes all-in, UTG calls.

Turn: ($11.05) K[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (2 players)

River: ($11.05) 8[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (2 players)

Final Pot: $22.67

As always, I'm grateful for all your comments and criticism. I'm especially concerned with how we would play this against a better player.

AC

john voight · #2 10-08-2007, 11:05 PM

pf call; a bit thin
flop; standard

Unknown Soldier · #3 10-08-2007, 11:15 PM

pf is fine vs this monkey. see my other post about pf in the oesd post. This guy will be sooo exploitable. You want to play a really wide range against him. esp. ip.

Jauron · #4 10-08-2007, 11:53 PM

UTG will ALWAYS call us. Long run blah blah blah, I wouldn't do it if we were both deep.

I like the play more vs TAG, they don't look us up as often.

You're No Daisy · #5 10-09-2007, 09:32 AM

[ QUOTE ]
pf call; a bit thin
flop; standard

[/ QUOTE ]
Preflop call thin? Why? I typically raise limpers with a hand like this on the button. Against this guy, it's def worth a call. He plays just about every hand! I ran the numbers on Poker Stove and my specific hand is still ahead of his range (82% VP$IP):

equity win tie pots won pots tied
Hand 0: 58.582% 56.55% 02.04% 971130831 34973261.50 { Ac6c }
Hand 1: 41.418% 39.38% 02.04% 676363558 34973261.50 { 22+, A2s+, K2s+, Q2s+, J2s+, T2s+, 92s+, 82s+, 72s+, 62s+, 52s+, 42s+, 32s, A2o+, K2o+, Q2o+, J8o+, J2o, T6o+, 96o+, 85o+, 74o+, 64o+, 62o, 52o+, 42o+, 32o }

On the flop I'm way ahead, and as you said, is standard:

Board: 5c 7c 4d
Dead:

equity win tie pots won pots tied
Hand 0: 72.528% 70.30% 02.22% 618752 19578.00 { Ac6c }
Hand 1: 27.472% 25.25% 02.22% 222202 19578.00 { 22+, A2s+, K2s+, Q2s+, J2s+, T2s+, 92s+, 82s+, 72s+, 62s+, 52s+, 42s+, 32s, A2o+, K2o+, Q2o+, J8o+, J2o, T6o+, 96o+, 85o+, 74o+, 64o+, 62o, 52o+, 42o+, 32o }

AC

Micro Donk · #6 10-09-2007, 09:34 AM

[ QUOTE ]
He plays just about every hand!

[/ QUOTE ]

for a limp

Perk76 · #7 10-09-2007, 09:45 AM

I like it.

I even like the calling preflop against this guy. If someone is running 80/20 and I can call on the btn or IP, I like to play pots with the person. As long you feel like the blinds wont 3bet, I try to play as many pots with this type of player. Someone is gonna get his money, and I want as many chances as possible to make it happen. I am willing to play marginal hands since I feel like I can out play a villan like this. Alot of villans like this have low CB frequency on the flop which allows you to take free cards also if needed.

Against a TAG, I wont be calling with garbage on the btn.

You're No Daisy · #8 10-09-2007, 09:54 AM

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
He plays just about every hand!

[/ QUOTE ]

for a limp

[/ QUOTE ]
Sure...but his range is very wide here. 23% of his raising hands are any pair, any broadway, any ace, any suited connectors 54s+. Based upon the fact I have seen him raise with 86o, T4s, 75o from EP I'll take my chances. Basically, this guy was full of [censored]. Since I had position and a hand that loves position, it was a good call.

If villain was 82/5/2.35 I would probably consider folding. Because now his range for raising is much tighter with pairs 77+, AK, AQs or pairs 99+, AK, AQ. Thanks for your input. I really appreciate it.

AC

You're No Daisy · #9 10-09-2007, 09:59 AM

So even against a TAG who raised 3.5xBB from UTG we don't have the implied odds to call? I'm just wondering because against an opponent who is 82/23 I think this is a no brainer. Is the reason we don't call a TAG with position with a suited Ace because we generally won't see a flop like this in most cases? How are implied odds determined in a case like this; and can we apply the 5/10 rule here, or is that only reserved for set mining? Thanks in advance for your input.

AC

Perk76 · #10 10-09-2007, 10:06 AM

Calling against a TAG is only going to get you in trouble. Since you will end up committing chips post flop against a range that crushes your A6. If an ace hits the flop you will most likely float at least a flop bet or put more chips in than you should. Even if you flop 2 pair and get it all in against AK/AQ you will get resucked out on alot, or be up against AA.

Personally if you know that a TAG will over play his hands I would rather take a flyer and cold call with sc's or a hand I am willing to float one time with intentions of taking it away on the turn.