**Official uNL Microbrew thread: September**

[Frosteater]

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Who do you think you make your money off of? The "good" 20/18/3 players? All you are really doing is pushing the money back & forth with those players at the cost of rake, waiting for the 60/5/.5 players in the game to give you the money you count as profit. If you aren't leveling, then... wow. Fundamental Theorem of Poker or whatever...

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Not necessarily the "good" 20/18/3, but more the weak 40/12/2, who can at least occasionally fold and can be put on a hand once in a while. Fundamental Theorem, as you mentioned, which someone throws completely out of the picture, who just constantly calls anything. As long as I don't hit the majority of the flops, I'd prefer opposition that is actually capable of folding.

It's really sad that I get outplayed by fish, though.

Edit:
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work on value betting

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In theory I know this is the key. And it's quite easy with AK on Kh5c4c. QQ on the same board is a different story, since there's no way to find out if the mastermind limp-called K2o or Tc7c. It's call-call-call either way. It's probably just me, but situations like the latter seem to happen a lot more often than the former.

I wouldn't say the regs are transparent (not necessarily to me, anyway), but at least you can put them on a range depending on their actions.

[LT22]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Who do you think you make your money off of? The "good" 20/18/3 players? All you are really doing is pushing the money back & forth with those players at the cost of rake, waiting for the 60/5/.5 players in the game to give you the money you count as profit. If you aren't leveling, then... wow. Fundamental Theorem of Poker or whatever...

[/ QUOTE ]

Not necessarily the "good" 20/18/3, but more the weak 40/12/2, who can at least occasionally fold and can be put on a hand once in a while. Fundamental Theorem, as you mentioned, which someone throws completely out of the picture, who just constantly calls anything. As long as I don't hit the majority of the flops, I'd prefer opposition that is actually capable of folding.

It's really sad that I get outplayed by fish, though.

[/ QUOTE ]

don't c-bet flops that u miss and have zero change of fold equity
don't isolate them with garbage (ie tighten your range if you're really that bad)---normally I suggest isolating these types of idiots a ton, but obv you have a problem with value betting/hand reading
????
profit

[Mr_Pathetic]

My general rule of thumb for the call call call types is to bet bet bet till they raise raise raise. Sometimes I vb worse but most times I don't. If you feel this isn't how it happens to you then you might just be in a bad patch. I just went though 14k hands of vb second best hands and breaking even. Last few days that has turned around and boom, back to vb the best hand and taking huge chunks of their stacks.

The call call call types add variance to the game so beware of that. You never know where they are and you end of betting into them with lots of hands. Your QQ example on the K45 board I would just bet that [censored] to river and if he raises let go otherwise keep betting. He will show up with enough draws there to make it ok I think. I might check river, just depends.

[Frosteater]

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normally I suggest isolating these types of idiots a ton, but obv you have a problem with value betting/hand reading

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The biggest problem I have is the fact that these types of idiots render my positional play completely useless, since blindsteals and 3bets vs button with marginal hands usually have to face postflop action.

Still, thanks a lot for the input, guys. I'll try to implement that stuff the next time I'll encounter this situation, until I'm able to deal with this species.

[C4LL4W4Y]

i've seen supposedly 'good' 20/18/3 tag's make horrendous decisions postflop, and i believe they're the ones that make destroying these stakes very possible. the fish are usually worse too, but they're donking it off no matter what - if you're beating 'tags' with good postflop play, you can make a significant additional profit.

that being said, don't go out of your way to play against them. if you spot a leak in their game, use it to your advantage, but don't go overboard.

[Mr_Pathetic]

20/18/3 making bad decisions is me. I think I am down -2.5 to C4LL4W4Y lol.

[Sean Fraley]

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Who is MacsenWledig on Stars? Out yourself!

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Tis I. Why, was I good?

EDIT: BTW, I was calling less than 10% of the effectives stacks + what was already in the pot, and I put you on a high pair that you would stack off with if I the set. You can't fault me on that hand.

[LT22]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
normally I suggest isolating these types of idiots a ton, but obv you have a problem with value betting/hand reading

[/ QUOTE ]

The biggest problem I have is the fact that these types of idiots render my positional play completely useless, since blindsteals and 3bets vs button with marginal hands usually have to face postflop action.

Still, thanks a lot for the input, guys. I'll try to implement that stuff the next time I'll encounter this situation, until I'm able to deal with this species.

[/ QUOTE ]

YO WHAT????????????

[Sean Fraley]

FWIW, seeing a table full of 60/5/.5 types with a seat open is enough to get me hard.

[thing85]

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FWIW, seeing a table full of 60/5/.5 types with a seat open is enough to get me hard.

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Do these tables even exist anymore?