Stop win?

mbsocc1346 · #1 09-10-2007, 03:13 AM

I've heard of Stop/losses, however, has anyone here set stop/wins?

If so, what is your stop win.

I just was playing 1/2 and had an 800$ stack, and decided to keep playing, and then after 6 hours only had 250, and I was very upset with myself and my play. Using a stop/win, i could have saved myself.

I am thinking about setting a 2 buy in stop/win where if i have a 600+ stack, I should cash out. Thoughts?

postoakpoker · #2 09-10-2007, 03:31 AM

IMHO, you should consider leaving the table if the factors that made the game profitable are no longer present. For instance, if an atm leaves, you start to get tired or worn out, or you take a bad beat/make a stupid play. Some of these factors are more important than others, but even just one of these being eliminated can reduce EV, or possibly put it into the negative. This is coming from someone who's blown plenty of juice playing way too late.

It seems to me that a stop/win level indicates either a lack of confidence or a financial situation where you maybe shouldn't be playing poker in the first place.

pfapfap · #3 09-10-2007, 04:01 AM

As I play more for profit, I wonder about this concept.

First, I'm not afraid to keep playing, no matter the size of my stack. I always want as many chips as possible. I play well within my bankroll. But I also know that my overall rate is $x/hr. So if I have a particularly good streak and go up faster than that rate, what's wrong with simply saying, "hey, great," and stopping playing and going on to do something else? My hourly rate for that session is likely to go down if I continue.

ChadK · #4 09-10-2007, 04:28 AM

Well i used to think the same as the to previous replies. But a couple of weeks ago I was up 2 by-ins and got in a hand where I had the nut str8 on the turn got the $$ allin and the vilian rivered a boat. Now for live play I really only have 2-5NL as an option and my BR is only about 4 by-ins so I have now implemented a stop/win of +2 by-ins. If I was properly bankrolled I would not have a stop/win.

Rek · #5 09-10-2007, 05:11 AM

[ QUOTE ]
As I play more for profit, I wonder about this concept.

First, I'm not afraid to keep playing, no matter the size of my stack. I always want as many chips as possible. I play well within my bankroll. But I also know that my overall rate is $x/hr. So if I have a particularly good streak and go up faster than that rate, what's wrong with simply saying, "hey, great," and stopping playing and going on to do something else? My hourly rate for that session is likely to go down if I continue.

[/ QUOTE ]

You seem to be contradicting yourself here. You say you're not afraid to keep playing and then say the rate for that session is likely to go down if you keep playing. This is just not true.

I am assuming you have played 000's of games because you know your $x/hr. This is the real point. It does not matter if you are running good or bad per session, over the long term your rate will even out. Just because you are having a good session does not mean it is about to end. The same as a bad session doesn't have to end because you are dropping below your $x/hr.

If you are a winning player and you earn say $20/hr then for every hour you don't play you give up that $20. Whether varience is with or against you in any particular session is slightly irrelevant in the long term providing you are correctly bankrolled.

Providing the conditions are still ok and you are playing your normal game there is no need to stop.

pfapfap · #6 09-10-2007, 11:13 AM

[ QUOTE ]
You seem to be contradicting yourself here. You say you're not afraid to keep playing and then say the rate for that session is likely to go down if you keep playing. This is just not true.

[/ QUOTE ]

Perhaps I wasn't clear. Let's say I have an amazing run and go up 3 buyins over the course of a few hands within half an hour. Unless I maintain that rate, my hourly for that session will go down. Yeah, I know it's all just one big session, but why not read that as "hey, day's pay" and go to the beach or something?

[ QUOTE ]
Just because you are having a good session does not mean it is about to end.

[/ QUOTE ]

Just because I'm having a good session doesn't mean it's about to continue, either.

[ QUOTE ]
If you are a winning player and you earn say $20/hr then for every hour you don't play you give up that $20.

[/ QUOTE ]

Now, this is simply ridiculous. Why do anything at all that's not poker, then? Why sleep? You're giving up $20/hr! Pishaw, I work to live, not vice versa. I'll be able to do that $20/hr whenever I want. I don't need to stay in a session just so I don't give it up.

[ QUOTE ]
Providing the conditions are still ok and you are playing your normal game there is no need to stop.

[/ QUOTE ]

But is there need to continue? Why NOT stop on the high side of variance, then come back later refreshed?

Rek · #7 09-10-2007, 12:01 PM

Hi pfapfap - I wasn't having a go and your points are valid if you only want to think short term. However, if you have been playing for a considerable time (which it sounds as though you have) and you are a serious player you should know your win rate per hour. If you do, then that is your rate for your ability and stakes.

And yes, if your rate is $20/hr and you don't play for an hour you are giving up $20. The fact is we can't play at our optimum level non stop and we must sleep etc. But it is no different from say a self-employed decorator who earns $20/hr. If he decides not to work for an hour he doesn't make the $20.

RedSoxFan · #8 09-10-2007, 12:05 PM

I think a lot of people have had this same dilemma. I'm pretty new to 2+2 but one thing that helped my game was a post I read about not being results oriented. When I'm up big, my decision to leave or to stay is not based on my stack size. My decision is based on table conditions and my mental state (both mentioned by postoakpoker). If the table still favors me and I am still making the right decisions (regardless of outcome of hands), I'll stay. If the table sucks and I am tired or whatever, I'll cash in and leave. This is easier playing online because you can cash in and go find a better table. If at a casino- maybe cash in, go grab some food and caffeine and play in an hour.

Triantafylidis · #9 09-10-2007, 02:53 PM

[ QUOTE ]
Well i used to think the same as the to previous replies. But a couple of weeks ago I was up 2 by-ins and got in a hand where I had the nut str8 on the turn got the $$ allin and the vilian rivered a boat. Now for live play I really only have 2-5NL as an option and my BR is only about 4 by-ins so I have now implemented a stop/win of +2 by-ins. If I was properly bankrolled I would not have a stop/win.

[/ QUOTE ]

4 buyin BR??
MOVE DOWWWNNNNN

ChadK · #10 09-10-2007, 06:50 PM

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Well i used to think the same as the to previous replies. But a couple of weeks ago I was up 2 by-ins and got in a hand where I had the nut str8 on the turn got the $$ allin and the vilian rivered a boat. Now for live play I really only have 2-5NL as an option and my BR is only about 4 by-ins so I have now implemented a stop/win of +2 by-ins. If I was properly bankrolled I would not have a stop/win.

[/ QUOTE ]

4 buyin BR??
MOVE DOWWWNNNNN

[/ QUOTE ]

I would if it were an option but like I said for live play 2-5 is the only NL game available to me.