Alcohol coming to Turning Stone?

njhockeyboy · #1 07-13-2007, 02:19 PM

http://www.turningstone.com/info/alcohol.pdf

(warning: long download)

This basically says that they're working with NY state to get a license to serve alcohol on the premises. It states "Our hope, and plan, is to allow full service of alcohol for our guests at each of our facilities in the near future."

I'm sure this is good news for some people...but will those between the ages of 18-20 still be able to play? And is this even likely to happen?

emmpee · #2 07-13-2007, 03:18 PM

gg Turning Stone web admins for linking a 12MB PDF (which is one page with < 150 words of content) on their front page. That'll be good for bandwidth usage.

emmpee · #3 07-13-2007, 03:24 PM

To save everyone from downloading it, the full text is:
[ QUOTE ]

To Serve You Better...

As part of our continuing efforts to enhance your resort experience,
we are working with the New York State government regarding the
serving of alcohol at Turning Stone Resort & Casino.

Our hope, and plan, is to allow full service of alcohol for our guests
at each of our facilities in the near future.

While our discussions with the State are underway, we must request
that our guests not bring alcoholic beverages into Turning Stone.
We believe this policy of not permitting alcoholic beverages onto
our premises provides us an opportunity to reach an agreement with
the State in a way that ultimately results in the best resort experience.

Thank you for your patience and understanding, and for your
cooperation during this transition period.

[/ QUOTE ]

PokerDonkey27 · #4 07-13-2007, 04:03 PM

1. I can not see how they will be able to serve alcohol and keep the minimum age for gambling at 18. I believe that was one of the reasons Turning Stone could allow those at 18-20 to enter, because there was no alcohol.

2. Do not expect the "negotiations" between Turning Stone and the State to be over quickly. Turning Stone has done nothing but step all over the State government; from the tax-free cigarettes to the claim that it was "sacred Indian land" and that they could do and build as they pleased. To the best of my knowledge, Turning Stone pays no taxes to the State, so do not expect the State to turn around and give them what it wants.

In order to receive approval to serve alcohol, Turning Stone is going to have to "give up" something to the State, and I see that being the taxes on cigarettes.

I grew up in NY and at Turning Stone; I was there for my 18th birthday. It is a great place and it is good to see the growth they have experienced since my first visit in 1998 and when I recently visited 12/2006, and they are investing money back into the facility. However, they may be in for a rough battle here, "banning" alcohol (instead of not serving it and allowing patrons to bring/consume their own) and trying to negotiate with the State of NY.

FCBLComish · #5 07-14-2007, 02:04 AM

[ QUOTE ]
1. I can not see how they will be able to serve alcohol and keep the minimum age for gambling at 18. I believe that was one of the reasons Turning Stone could allow those at 18-20 to enter, because there was no alcohol.

2. Do not expect the "negotiations" between Turning Stone and the State to be over quickly. Turning Stone has done nothing but step all over the State government; from the tax-free cigarettes to the claim that it was "sacred Indian land" and that they could do and build as they pleased. To the best of my knowledge, Turning Stone pays no taxes to the State, so do not expect the State to turn around and give them what it wants.

In order to receive approval to serve alcohol, Turning Stone is going to have to "give up" something to the State, and I see that being the taxes on cigarettes.

I grew up in NY and at Turning Stone; I was there for my 18th birthday. It is a great place and it is good to see the growth they have experienced since my first visit in 1998 and when I recently visited 12/2006, and they are investing money back into the facility. However, they may be in for a rough battle here, "banning" alcohol (instead of not serving it and allowing patrons to bring/consume their own) and trying to negotiate with the State of NY.

[/ QUOTE ]

Ray Halbritter and the Oneida Indian Nation will not give up ANYTHING to the state. Good luck with your alcohol license.

Soupy · #6 07-14-2007, 02:27 AM

was there this past week, take this for what its worth, its obviously just some hearsay...

talking with a dealer at the poker tables about if they will get alcohol, he didnt seem to think it was happening any time soon, he also said that people were allowed to bring alcohol in just no name brands? so if you need a drink just throw in in a water bottle and you will be fine. again this is just from a dealer so i cant vouch for how accurate it is

kickabuck · #7 07-14-2007, 04:43 AM

Turning Stone has been claiming to be working on a liquor license for years. In fact, there was a stand-alone sign stating as much in front of the showroom 2 or 3 years ago, yet still there is no booze. I wouldn't hold my breath waiting for alcohol sales at the Turning Stone.

Poshua · #8 07-14-2007, 04:17 PM

Anyone know why the state can prevent them from serving alcohol but not from providing casino gambling? I'd think the same sovereignty that exempts them from state gambling laws would also exempt them from state liquor licensing laws. Is it that the tribal compact they agreed to with the state prohibited them from serving alcohol, and now they want to renegotiate the compact?

tangled · #9 07-14-2007, 05:45 PM

Good question.
Also, even if the state does have an essential say in whether the casino gets a license or not, I would like to know how they can deny the casino a license just because they are mad at them. Isn't this why we have courts? I am sure the state can make it hard for them to get a license, but eventually the casino (I would think) would prevail.

Poshua · #10 07-14-2007, 05:53 PM

[ QUOTE ]
Good question.
Also, even if the state does have an essential say in whether the casino gets a license or not, I would like to know how they can deny the casino a license just because they are mad at them. Isn't this why we have courts? I am sure the state can make it hard for them to get a license, but eventually the casino (I would think) would prevail.

[/ QUOTE ]

This depends a lot on the state. However, Indian casinos have a much freer hand than other casinos. Generally, a state has to permit Indian gaming so long as there is any other legal gambling in the state. (States with no legal gambling, which I believe are down to just Utah and Hawaii, do not have to permit Indian gaming.) The state will negotiate a compact that sets certain regulations-- for example, Connecticut requires a last-call time for alcohol, and California prohibits table games that don't use playing cards-- but ultimately the state has to allow gaming on Indian reservations.

In states that have non-Indian casino gambling, the state will generally have a licensing commission with broad discretion to issue licenses or not. This is somewhat similar to liquor licensing in cities-- while a restaurant or bar can appeal the denial of a license, the licensing authority has great leeway to issue licenses or not as it chooses.