We win (AP Scandal v. 27)

[Michaelson]

I asked this before but with no response. What exactly do we know about the status of Scott Tom and AJ Green within the Absolute Poker organisation. As I understand it, there is circumstantial evidence that Tom, at least, was involved with AP as recently as this June and July (his spamming this forum and the email posted earlier in this thread linking him to a different account), but the company's official stance--or Mark Seif's official stance, or from somewhere else I can't remember--is that they have not been a part of AP in at least a year. Am I correct that this is where we stand wrt these two and their organisational status?

If so, can I ask how it can be so hard to determine? I'm certainly not having a go at the people looking into this who have been amazing. It's not like I'm saying "why has no one googled this?" Rather, I just don't understand why it's so hard to come by this information, particularly with access to sources within AP which several people seem to have.

Maybe I'm alone on this, but I think establishing exactly what relationship existed between the cheaters and AP is critical to determine the nature and scope of this scandal.

[mntbikr15]

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admiralfluff:

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In this case, it would be getting AP to access the master history for these hands, and looking to see if 363 sits down after Seif takes his break.

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If I were an innocent Mark Seif, I would request these hands from AP. This would even be a good time to have said hands certified as true and correct in the forthcoming audit.

Seif has a great opportunity to "own" the board with easily obtainable information.

hmmm, I guess his opponent could also request the hands from AP.

gg

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hahaha ur assuming AP will actually send it

They are too dumb to send it half the time anyway, much less when they have reason not too

[StepBangin]

Josem, in a previous post, N82 said something along the lines of how he might never feel comfortable ever publicly saying what he "really" did. He also says something about messing around with THESE guys doesnt sound like a good idea.

What does he mean by "messing around"?

Who are "These guys" and why doesnt it sound like a good idea?

Can you elaborate at all about what he means by "What I "really" did"?

This whole scandal is just mind blowing and extremely interesting to me.
It also amazes me how you guys figured everything out.

[marchron]

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CardPlayer article

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[Pokeraddict]

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CardPlayer article

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That shows where their motives are.

[mntbikr15]

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CardPlayer article

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hah....nice catch

[Knytestorme]

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Nat, seriously, p.m. me. we'll exchange information, and the next time you're in vegas, i'm taking to you buffalo wild wings.

[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]

also, serge and josem.

but only if i can call you sUrge, and not serghey.



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Same offer but directed more at Josem next time he's in Canberra.

Lot of great work being done here and would have offered my help with it from a c/s dev security perspective but every time I caught up to the latest post and had ideas to add there were another 10 pages to start on again [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

[Dilznoofus]

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Seif also denied that the Potripper replay looked like cheating.

Given what we know now, it's extremely likely he cheated in this case. This does not constitue definitive proof. I think discussions here should focus on the evidence, and how to collect it. In this case, it would be getting AP to access the master history for these hands, and looking to see if 363 sits down after Seif takes his break. Simply speculating on the likelihood of him being a cheater won't get us anywhere. We know it's high, but not high enough to say 'he did it'.

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I understand, and I won't post any more on the subject. It just seemed like a lot of people had given up on this because of the impression that the alleged victim had recanted, which is simply not the case. stuckinpgh wouldn't say he was cheated, but he never backed away from his original account of what happened.

Edit: And Dan Druff seemed to vouch for stuckinpgh's version of events based on the text I quoted.

[mrmandelbrot]

I haven't seen this mentioned before so I'll throw it out. It seems vaguely possible that an individual or group of individuals from within AP have used Scott Tom's info to try to cover their own tracks. But if that's not the case, as seems to be implied by AP's reluctance to come clean about all this, the alternative is gloomier than has been acknowledged. Those hoping for an extensive audit are going to be let down. What's happening now is that all the evidence of the 363 account is being shredded except for what has already gotten out. Remember the mountains of shredded paper that came out of Enron?

[marchron]

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CardPlayer article

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hah....nice catch

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I also think "adaments" and "adamant" are a pretty apropos homonym. Or is it homophone? I can never remember.