o8poker.com's starting hand suggestions... (PLO8)

[laeelin]

o8poker.com has a starting hand list for beginners...

Link to the starting hand suggestions: http://www.o8poker.com/Getting/starting1.htm

Does this look like a good starting point till your beating the game by a reasonable amount? (full ring, PLO8)

[sfgiants]

My impression is that those hands are for limit O8, but I could be wrong. Certainly there is a great deal of overlay between PLO8 and LO8.

[jasonHoldEm]

I'm still new at this but the big main difference in starting hands between LO8 and PLO8 is that in PLO8 you need all four of your cards to be working together much moreso than in limit. Two-way hands like A3KT become much less playable because you're going to need near-perfect boards to have scoop potential and you're going to be vulnerable to being counterfeited/freerolled.

PLO8 becomes a game of 3/4'ing your opponent rather than scooping him. While everyone loves a scoop reasonable players will still fold when the don't have a chance either way but they'll pay off pot sized bets all the way when they have one way locked up even though they have absolutely no hope for the other side of the pot...because it's pot limit those 3/4 pots make for a lot of extra money in your pocket.

Anyways, the best sort of hands to play become AWWW or AAWW type hands (or AWW6/AAW6 since the 6 will give you 3/4'r potential against another wheel). High hands are also playable since if you get the right flop you'll have the potential to freeroll your opponent (i.e. You have AKQJds your opponent holds A23K the flop is QJT, many opponents will go to the felt with their broadway straight and either get their money back or you scoop them by making a flush/full house).

So in a nutshell...prefer to play hands that fall completely on one end of the spectrum or the other and avoid middle cards and two-way hands (although two-way hands are still playable they just need to be played cheaply and carefully).

jHE

[bbartlog]

You have AKQJds your opponent holds A23K the flop is QJT

And if the flop is AKLr, now who is freerolling who? (note that there are many more AKL flops than QJT flops, even if two people are holding AKxx...). There's a reason that A23K is considered excellent while AKQJds is merely good.
I also disagree with the general point (if I read you right) that you need to play tighter in PLO8 than in LO8. The greater implied odds in PLO8 make speculative hands more playable, though not by as great a margin as some people seem to think.

[jasonHoldEm]

I agree that once you understand how to properly evaluate your hand on the flop you can play more loosely in late position, but up front and/or in an aggressive game you should be focusing on the stronger holdings.

That said, I don't think a beginner would go all that wrong by avoiding the speculative hands altogether when starting out because they usually won't realize how weak their hand is and will get trapped (i.e. A2TK on a 678 flop and a pot-sized bet to them..."ooooh I've got the nut low!"). They become the hunted instead of the hunter.

jHE

[Al P]

So realistically at full ring should a newbie be playing about 10-15% of hands?