L/C Help me. Lack of an afterlife leads me do depression.

[hitch1978]

I am 29y/o.

I feel like I am near death, this feeling comes from my awareness of infinity, and the relation of my finite existence to it.

I also make this same relation to the life of my son and daughter who are combined aged <3.

I believe that when I die there is nothing. I also believe that the same is true for anyone I care about, and who cares about me.

The combination above seriously depresses me. I fear death, and I think about it several times daily, with increasing regularity to the point where it is starting to become a problem.

I am developing an alcohol dependancy that interests me, as it both helps me deal with the issue, while also bringing it forward due to the physical effects of consumption.

In short I am ferociously embracing a lifestyle that will reduce the exposure to the pain I currently feel.

I know I have no right to ask for advice/help under such terms, I just thought it would make for an interesting discussion amongst you that I may gain from. Nothing would please me more than finding a 'solution', and that is obviously my motive, but I am not sure that my condition is cureable.

[Limesparks]

†

[FortunaMaximus]

Pragmatic advice: Seek help and I'd certainly curtail the drinking considering you have two young children to raise.

Philosophical advice: There isn't a solution. Most everybody needs a reason to get throughout the day without the ennui of despair. I've been in a similar situation and gone completely nuts over it with the aid of substances. Definitely not something I suggest as an optimal path.

This is what I don't get, if you think there's nothing when you die, why even fear death? While I understand the despair you speak of, over time logic will make you realize you shouldn't fear or embrace it, but be indifferent to it. It happens anyway.

Awareness of infinity is one of the prices of self-awareness. Tough [censored], but it can be dealt with.

[hitch1978]

TY for responding.

[ QUOTE ]

This is what I don't get, if you think there's nothing when you die, why even fear death?

[/ QUOTE ]

This is EVERYTHING about the issue as far as I am concerned.

I don't know. I am a generally rational being, and I think that is a big part of it. How do you think you will FEEL on your death bed? Seriously? 1 second to go, and you are aware of it? I can't think of any worse feeling, and I know it's coming, and I know that nothing (else) matters.

The brackets are important, because 1) nothing matters (see OP) and 2) if nothing matters then ultimately all I have is my last 1 second.

P.S. I am not stubbornly trying to argue my point, I am genuinely hoping to understand something you all 'get'.

[hitch1978]

Also I should have added -

Why are you not bothered about ceasing to 'be'?

[FortunaMaximus]

[ QUOTE ]
How do you think you will FEEL on your death bed? Seriously? 1 second to go, and you are aware of it? I can't think of any worse feeling, and I know it's coming, and I know that nothing (else) matters.

[/ QUOTE ]

I realize that. It can be the worst feeling in the world to deal with. But you do get over it when you realize you can't solve the problem rationally. I think you're in a phase where you're seriously facing your mortality for the first time and it royally [censored] sucks. Most people do get over it, however.

Painful as it is to realize, there is simply nothing you can do to prevent your own death, but you can certainly accelerate the circumstances. That's why I suggested you at least seek help/stop drinking, because when you go down that path, you start to affect others' quality of life. And while it isn't selfish to mull over this issue, when it affects others'... You see where I'm going with this, so I'll can the sermon. There'll be a Christian by soon enough with a cyber-pamphlet.

[ QUOTE ]
Also I should have added -

Why are you not bothered about ceasing to 'be'?

[/ QUOTE ]

I am sometimes. But since I can't do anything about it, I shelve it. And I'm a very long-term thinker and an agnostic, so I have faith in our descendants solving all the issues concerned with this universe and being able to construct something infinite. Icy comfort but it's the best I could do for myself.

Mortality, like many other things, befuddles human logic, so you have religion and other outlets.

[AWoodside]

Spend a couple hours reading up on the Transhumanist movement. Wiki page for a start

There are very strong arguments that you may not ever die. I don't mean in some sort of hand-wavy, "information is never lost and everything is connected" hippie kind of way. I mean it literally. You are living on the cusp of an age in which mankind will be able to overcome death through technological means. Your consciousness may exist indefinitely.

It's certainly not a sure thing, but at 29 if you adopt a healthy and risk averse lifestyle there is a very good chance that you will be alive when these technological advancements occur. Your children have a great chance.
At a glance it may seem loony, but there is a very deep and nuanced body of philosophical and scientific thought devoted to this issue if you look. May give you some hope.

[AWoodside]

[ QUOTE ]
Also I should have added -

Why are you not bothered about ceasing to 'be'?

[/ QUOTE ]

You should be bothered by it, terribly terribly bothered and the things you are going through are perfectly normal. Ceasing to exist is the absolute worst thing that can happen to a sentient being. The fact that most people take it as axiomatic that this is a necessary aspect of the human condition is terrifying and defeatist. There is no reason aging shouldn't be irradiated in the near future like the disease it is. Unless technological progress is artificially or catastrophically halted this is inevitable. The actions we take as a society will determine whether this new phase in human development comes in 50 years or 300.

You are completely right to be upset about this, but instead of being depressed get energized and proactive, because their is hope. Do some online research into the possibility of indefinite health-spans within your lifetime and if you're convinced its a possibility focus your energies into educating others and committing resources to that goal.

p.s.

Come to think of it, most people DO NOT actually take it as axiomatic that dying is a necessary part of the human condition. Most people are theistic and believe in some sort of "life after death". Quite the coping mechanism I'd say. For those of us who are rational, we do not have that luxury. Luckily we've born in a time in which its conceivable that true immortality might be achieved.

[NotReady]

[ QUOTE ]

Nothing would please me more than finding a 'solution', and that is obviously my motive, but I am not sure that my condition is cureable.


[/ QUOTE ]

1 Corinthians 15:
26The last enemy that will be abolished is death.


53For this perishable must put on the imperishable, and this mortal must put on immortality.

54But when this perishable will have put on the imperishable, and this mortal will have put on immortality, then will come about the saying that is written, "DEATH IS SWALLOWED UP in victory.

55"O DEATH, WHERE IS YOUR VICTORY? O DEATH, WHERE IS YOUR STING?"

56The sting of death is sin, and the power of sin is the law;

57but thanks be to God, who gives us the victory through our Lord Jesus Christ.


2 Timothy 1:10
but it has now been revealed through the appearing of our Savior, Christ Jesus, who has destroyed death and has brought life and immortality to light through the gospel.

[hitch1978]

Fortuna,

Drinking = Smoking. Discuss.

That is not a throw away comment BTW.

I appreciate everything you say, however I believe it may be a bigger issue for me as I remember the first time I cried because I was gonna die was when I was twelve (I think) when Freddie Mercury died, my mum's hero. I really look up to people like you, and madnack and Phil, that can look at life logically and not be phased by the fact that in 1000 years nothing you do counts.

I Know that everything I do counts for my daughter (eg) and that it matters 100%. I do everything possible to raise my kids the best way I can. A good analogy is of the 1,000,000 starfish on the beach all drying out in the sun. I care for the starfish I can, but that doesn't make my life any more significant, does it?