TP2K in 3bet pot (NL50)

[Sheetah]

HU cash $0.25/$0.5

SB/BTN . . . HERO $67 [K[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img],T[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]]
BB . . . . . VILLAIN $55

HERO raises $1.5, VILLAIN re-raises $5.5, HERO calls
(pot: $10.45)

FLOP: 2[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] 4[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] T[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]
VILLAIN insta-bets $8, HERO calls
(pot: $25.65)

TURN: 8[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]
VILLAIN insta-bets $30
HERO ???

(VILLAIN - $11.60 left behind)
(HERO - $53.5 left behind)


When he sat at my table, it seemed he knew how to play. Folding to my button raises, raising in position (but folding mostly) and immediately reloading to full stack (just as I did). Not many flops were seen and few flops he decided to play - he played extremely weak. Somewhere in the middle of the game an idea popped:" He's afraid of postflop! His game revolves around taking pots preflop!". However since I was not playing ordinary donk and since he was pretty tight for HU standards, I didn't really feel like making some crazy bluffs.
After 15 min or so, as my button PFR approached 90% he started to play back by 3betting me preflop. Most of the time I gave up, but on two occasions I looked him up and he immediately let the pot go. Slowly I was getting a feeling he's sick of me shamelessly abusing the button and that he was semi-tilting a little.

Then the ^^^ hand came. Based on how he played it felt kinda weird seeing him insta-betting, since he usually took more. So lets say <insert Obi Van's voice here>:"I feel disturbance in The Force".

[emKay]

You have to fold preflop when you are not willing to get it in on such a board.

[Tupacia]

[ QUOTE ]
You have to fold preflop when you are not willing to get it in on such a board.

[/ QUOTE ]

Exactly. You have to raise his flop cbet. Playing TPTK passively in a reraised pot in position is a losing proposition.

[abcjnich]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
You have to fold preflop when you are not willing to get it in on such a board.

[/ QUOTE ]

Exactly. You have to raise his flop cbet. Playing TPTK passively in a reraised pot in position is a losing proposition.

[/ QUOTE ]

Agree with the first comment, not with the second. Please explain why you should raise this flop instead of just calling.

Anyway, you called pf- to get it in on good boards. This is a near perfect board. Get the money in.

[tmcdmck]

[ QUOTE ]
Anyway, you called pf- to get it in on good boards. This is a near perfect board. Get the money in.

[/ QUOTE ]

dear lord i hate that reasoning: there is a good chance preflop was a mistake, therefore getting it in using that reasoning is a compounded mistake. maybe it would be correct to get it in, i am undecided, but for the love of all that is poker, do not do it because of reasoning like that.

seriously though the reasoning is pretty much

"hmm well i called preflop, this flop is about as good as i could have hoped for. folding would be admitting i made a mistake preflop, therefore i should call!"

[Kalledrengen]

Nice villain description.

Tough spot here..

One one side, we want to call. Seems like it is possible villain is making a stand, fighting back on your constant PF raise..
On the other side, we have a villain here who has reraised you PF, insta bet (almost PSB) both turn and river OOP. He screams AT, overpair or perhaps AK kinda hand..

Not really sure.. I think I call here most of the times... I think I need a solid read in order to let him have it.

*edit*

[ QUOTE ]

You have to fold preflop when you are not willing to get it in on such a board.

[/ QUOTE ]

Nicely put, that makes sense

[mattak]

Preflop is close, but not really the issue here.

Flop: There is no draw to be afraid of so there is no real reason to raise. This is a classic case of way ahead or way behind IMO. Raising gets air (AK, AQ etc) to fold and gets you pot committed vs. hands that have you beat (over pair, AT etc). There is no value in raising this hand. The question is are you willing to get it in here on the flop? If you are, then play the hand in such a way that will get the most money into the middle from his entire range. To me this means calling the flop in hopes that he second barrel bluffs the turn.

Back to the question of are you willing to get it in on the flop. As someone else pointed out, you probably shouldn't call preflop if you arent happy about this flop. As well, based on your "disturbance in the force" read, I would probably be looking to stack him. This would be best accomplished be calling the flop and jamming the turn.

[Sheetah]

Some explanations:

*** I called pre cause:
- KTs is big hand against light 3bettor playing back at button PFR 90%
- he's weak postflop
- I have position

*** I called flop cause:
- I have TP - not much, but also not bad for HU
- his bet is either overpair vbet or air (overs maybe) - why loose him if I'm way ahead
- even for light 3bettor K is significant part of his range - he has less outs and if K falls he's stacking off
- I was suspicious of weak postflop player suddenly going lionheart
- I got the impression "the pressure point" for this hand is yet to come - so I wanted to see what he does on turn ... and turn is extremely weird

My thinking ^^^ fine?



As played this is shove, right?

[Vinetou]

You played it right. I would probably also just call the flop, depends on the metagame. But definitely I am willing to felt top pair the majority of time. You need a good reason to fold top pair in HU. This doesn't seem like one of those spots.

I can't believe you posted the same hand on FTR. Is this really such a trouble hand? Seems standard to me.

[Sheetah]

I've been more active on FTR in the past and initially decided to post there but got no special attention. Since it was such a headache for me decided to repost here (and now that I think of it, being a HU addict I probably belong here).



... so I dropped into a tank and after full time given decided I'm ahead of his range and since turn brought many draws, decided shove is the best option:

HER0 shoves $53 (into $55 pot)
VILLAIN ...

... can you guess what he had?