Friend's hand

Frond · #1 10-19-2007, 07:21 PM

This is a hand from about a month ago that pal told me about. He was wondering how many bets he should go here with this flop.

8/16 live game I believe with not so exact details or reads. He said his opponent wasn't good though if that helps at all.

Friend has 99 somehere like MP and raises, 2 callers. Flop comes 972 rainbow. Friend bets, one guy raises him other folds, Friend 3's, Villain 4's, etc etc. How many bets should he go here with no cap HU? He wanted to know if there is a point to slow down at all with the current nuts so he doesn't give his hand away completely on da flop. I don't think Villain was short stacked at all.

I made no comments and told him I would post it here as best I could and see what responses I could relay to him.

BadBigBabar · #2 10-19-2007, 07:34 PM

lol cmon now

mntndrew · #3 10-19-2007, 07:40 PM

Do you have a read on villain as a hot chick that might appreciate being soft played?

One Outer · #4 10-19-2007, 08:16 PM

Um, I would never stop raising? Yeah, never stop sounds right.

Harv72b · #5 10-19-2007, 08:17 PM

Seems pretty obvious that the villain here is either drawing to 1 out or drawing to runner runner quads with 2 pair. The only way I could see slowing down at any point on the flop would be if your friend (Frond's Friend...catchy) felt that he could get more bets out of him by postponing the raising war until the turn. Against a bad opponent I doubt that it really matters.

PokerJans · #6 10-20-2007, 02:56 AM

8-16, it was the second or third orbit of a brand new game. The only thing villain had done was steal the blinds with JJ UTG and AK from MP(he loves to show his cards)

Here was the only hand I had played that the table saw. CO limped(lol) I limped J7s in the SB, BB checks.

J64, I bet, BB raise, CO fold, I three, he calls

Turn 5, I bet he calls

River 7 I bet he calls with J3o

Onto the hand, villain opens in EP1? I three ball 99 in the HJ, HU action

975 with two spades, he checks dark, I bet, he c/r, I three, he four, I five, he six, AND I JUST CALL!

At this point I was 100% positive I had the best hand but I thought 7 bets would totally give away my hand so my plan was to raise any turn, and that is what I did.

Thoughts?

One Outer · #7 10-20-2007, 03:03 AM

I think you might have already given your hand away. That being said I like your plan. Pop the turn.

StrictlyStrategy · #8 10-20-2007, 03:24 AM

[ QUOTE ]
8-16, it was the second or third orbit of a brand new game. The only thing villain had done was steal the blinds with JJ UTG and AK from MP(he loves to show his cards)

Here was the only hand I had played that the table saw. CO limped(lol) I limped J7s in the SB, BB checks.

J64, I bet, BB raise, CO fold, I three, he calls

Turn 5, I bet he calls

River 7 I bet he calls with J3o

Onto the hand, villain opens in EP1? I three ball 99 in the HJ, HU action

975 with two spades, he checks dark, I bet, he c/r, I three, he four, I five, he six, AND I JUST CALL!

At this point I was 100% positive I had the best hand but I thought 7 bets would totally give away my hand so my plan was to raise any turn, and that is what I did.

Thoughts?

[/ QUOTE ]

I honestly felt ashamed looking at this thread but at least there's discussion now.

I would fold PF for sure. You have a guy who's showing everything PF. Whenever people do this they have *a hand* He might have 22-77 I guess but you're playing 50-50 at best quite often here.

I'd go like 1,200 bets on this flop. Especially with a two flush. A TON of cards can come on the turn that he won't 3bet with.

I'm too stupid to do the math in my head but
If you call 6 bets, rather than go 7+, a scare card comes on the turn and he bets again(there's a REAL high chance he'll just call here after 'all the raising') and you raise, he'll almost never 3bet with a worse hand. This idea gains you 10SB, the 6 you put in on flop, and the 2BB/4SB on turn.

If you seven bet like you should he'll probably 8 bet because people get caught up in the action lots and will just go berserk for like 10 seconds before they think about things. The trick is to raise as fast as possible here. [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

So you'll go 9SB, maybe more, maybe 15SB here. Just say 9 because it still makes raising the flop right. Now if he calls your 9b and check calls the turn you have 11SB.

Holla.

Keep in mind you might just be able to say "You wanna just go all in?" and felt his ass.

James. · #9 10-20-2007, 08:22 AM

[ QUOTE ]
8-16, it was the second or third orbit of a brand new game. The only thing villain had done was steal the blinds with JJ UTG and AK from MP(he loves to show his cards)

Here was the only hand I had played that the table saw. CO limped(lol) I limped J7s in the SB, BB checks.

J64, I bet, BB raise, CO fold, I three, he calls

Turn 5, I bet he calls

River 7 I bet he calls with J3o

Onto the hand, villain opens in EP1? I three ball 99 in the HJ, HU action

975 with two spades, he checks dark, I bet, he c/r, I three, he four, I five, he six, AND I JUST CALL!

[/ QUOTE ]

i hate this. really hate it. so you think this guy is going to give more action if you call the 6bet, wait for him to bet the turn and raise?

problems:

a [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] comes on the turn 1 in 5 times. that kills your action.

a ace comes(if he has KK). this kills your action or puts you behind. i really think he has AA here always, but if he happens to show up with KK who knows how many bets he would go on the flop before the scarecard came on the turn.

who knows how many bets he'll go on the flop? he's already gone 6. he might go 6 more. if that's the case you lose money waiting for the turn because he certainly isn't 3betting when you announce you have the nuts by calling and raising fourth street. at that point you flip your cards face up. if you keep jamming the flop he may think you have JJ/QQ, etc. or even just a flush draw. in hold em there's something to be said about simply getting the money in when you can. this waiting for the turn business when you can 7 bet and possible 9 bet is ridiculous. GET THE MONEY IN NOW. too many bad things can happen on the turn if you wait to raise. jam the flop, eat a nice dinner, enjoy profit.

Frond · #10 10-20-2007, 11:17 AM

Glad PokerJ chimed in with the actual hand cause I wasn't sure of any reads and how it went down for certain. I knew there was slightly more to it than I had originally posted. Apologies gents.

My very first reaction when I heard the hand was that I wouldn't stop pumping it at all on the flop. I will stick with that. When you 3 bet him PF he is probably not thinking that you have a pair like 99 so it is hidden I would think to this schmo. He thinks that his big pair is still the best so charge him when you have the best of it as much as you can.