Borgata 1/2 hand

[beanland]

I hold AQo in late position. About $300 in stack.

Preflop player A (tight passive) raises to $15. Player B calls (seems tight, one other hand I saw shown down was KK). I call.

Flop: Q 9 6 rainbow.

Player A bets $25. Player B calls. I raise to $50.

A and B call.

Turn: T

Player A checks. Player B bets $100.

Your play?

[Kimpan]

hmm 3bet preflop, as played, make it 80 on the flop.

[beanland]

What about the turn? That's what I really want opinions on.

[Kimpan]

fold, I don't see how you can be good with 1 pair here.
Probably 78.

[mcpherzen]

[ QUOTE ]
I hold AQo in late position. About $300 in stack.

Preflop player A (tight passive) raises to $15. Player B calls (seems tight, one other hand I saw shown down was KK). I call.

Flop: Q 9 6 rainbow.

Player A bets $25. Player B calls. I raise to $50.

A and B call.

Turn: T

Player A checks. Player B bets $100.

Your play?

[/ QUOTE ]

My instincts tell me that turn lead into you is not a bluff or a semi-bluff. He thinks he has something. Whether or not he really has something (i.e. KJ, 78, QQ, TT) or just thinks he has something (i.e KQ, JT) obv. depends on how good he is. But you say he's tight, so I think you have to fold turn. All you really beat is KQ and air. And don't forget you still have opponent A left to act (he's the one who would have checked KJ there). And with only $150 behind (if you call turn), you're pot-committed if you play (you'll go all-in on the turn or someone will set you all in on the river). That's not where you want to be with one pair (even TPTK).

I don't mind your preflop call, and I think it's superior to raising. After all, you have position in the hand and you will definitely be behind if you get 4-bet preflop. But with TPTK on this flop, I think you need to agressively play for the pot then. I raise to $100-$125 on the flop here. If I get raised, I'm done with the hand. If I get called, I'm done with the hand unless I turn 2pr or trips. That size raise will get a lot of turns checked to you. You can check behind most of the time and try to show down TPTK for no additional exposure.

--Zen

[beanland]

Great comments...

Here's what happened.

I didn't see how I was good either so I folded. Player A calls (allin).

Player A shows: JJ
Player B shows: Q8

I hate this game.

[mcpherzen]

Don't beat yourself up too much. Making the occasional bad fold is an important part of playing good poker. It means you are capable of making folds at all, which clearly is essential to long-term success. Player B donked off and got very lucky (most opponents are going to auto-shove there with your hand). Good for him.

Notice how different this hand would have played out if you had played the flop correctly. If you raise to $125 (a pot-sized raise there would have been $148, so you aren't even betting the pot), player A probably calls all-in with his JJ (I think - it sounds like he has about $100 or so behind after his flop bet of $25), since he apparently wasn't going anywhere with a pretty painted pair. Q8 has top-pair with a horrible kicker, but he almost certainly calls since he does have TP and since player A is all-in. With all future betting on the side, he VERY likely checks the turn AND river to you (you check behind twice) and you show down and win a $450 pot.

--Zen

[Kimpan]

I don't agree that calling is better than 3betting preflop. You want to 3bet to know if your hand is good or not, you could easily be up against AA or KK here. If we are 4bet preflop we can through away our hand and avoid a difficult descision when a Q or an A hits the flop.

[sightless]

I muck this preflop, is that bad? aqo isnt that
great of a hand vs ep tight raiser and cold caller :/as played i raise more on flop to 75 or so and slow down
as played fold to turndonk

[johnnybeef]

[ QUOTE ]
Don't beat yourself up too much. Making the occasional bad fold is an important part of playing good poker. It means you are capable of making folds at all, which clearly is essential to long-term success. Player B donked off and got very lucky (most opponents are going to auto-shove there with your hand). Good for him.

Notice how different this hand would have played out if you had played the flop correctly. If you raise to $125 (a pot-sized raise there would have been $148, so you aren't even betting the pot), player A probably calls all-in with his JJ (I think - it sounds like he has about $100 or so behind after his flop bet of $25), since he apparently wasn't going anywhere with a pretty painted pair. Q8 has top-pair with a horrible kicker, but he almost certainly calls since he does have TP and since player A is all-in. With all future betting on the side, he VERY likely checks the turn AND river to you (you check behind twice) and you show down and win a $450 pot.

--Zen

[/ QUOTE ]

As usual, very insiteful post zen. Good to see you posting again.