SB blind defence with AK - Page 2

yourface · #11 10-09-2007, 08:41 AM

thanks for the responses guys. I was actually button in this hand and I had A[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]3[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]

what do you think of my river bet? I thought that this was the perfect river card to fold out AJ AK 55 77 88 A6, and it seems like most of you would make that fold.

oink I did some stoving for it yesterday which showed that the bet is +ev vs SB's perceived range so long as he folds those hands, and that it is -ev for him to call vs my hand range so long as I am raising most pairs and all strong draws on that flop and vb A9+ on the river

also very good for image I think

mattnxtc · #12 10-09-2007, 09:25 AM

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oink I did some stoving for it yesterday which showed that the bet is +ev vs SB's perceived range so long as he folds those hands, and that it is -ev for him to call vs my hand range so long as I am raising most pairs and all strong draws on that flop and vb A9+ on the river

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I think his frequency of folding this and his image of you has to play a huge role in your decision.

The straight up numbers say this its a good bet, but if his image of you makes him more likely to call you personally then maybe its not the greatest bet.

sethypooh21 · #13 10-09-2007, 05:09 PM

I think you have more FE if you raise the turn vs. LAGTAG. Flop raise in this spot screams "I has a draw" and though a lot of draws got there, spades missed and he's getting 8-1.

I mean, once you get there, sure fire the river - doesn't have to work that often, plus you get paid off when you have JJ/KQ here in the future.

vmacosta · #14 10-09-2007, 06:00 PM

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I think you have more FE if you raise the turn vs. LAGTAG. Flop raise in this spot screams "I has a draw" and though a lot of draws got there, spades missed and he's getting 8-1.

I mean, once you get there, sure fire the river - doesn't have to work that often, plus you get paid off when you have JJ/KQ here in the future.

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if you play good aggressive poker like yourface then raising the turn looks like you picked up a huge draw a lot more than it looks like you have AT.

yourface · #15 10-09-2007, 07:08 PM

I think vs a perceptive villain it is important to balance your range on whatever street you plan on making your move on, so that you leave him with crappy decisions with this kind of hand (weak showdownable hand). when it is very close whether he should be calling or folding, you can make note of what he is doing and adjust based on that

for instance, I am going to value bet the [censored] out of this guy from now on because I can almost guarantee he has a big fat note on my river play. now I expect him to get to showdown really really light against me, so I'll tone down the bluffs/semibluffs and step up the value bets. if I see him adjust, I'll change gears again

getting carried away a bit here but this is something I've been thinking about a lot lately especially regarding heads up play. I want to put villain in crappy spots so he is reacting to me, not vice versa, because I feel that this way I can make the strongest adjustments

vs me a perceptive villain is going to feel a lot more comfortable calling down a turn raise if the turn brings a draw, because as vma mentions my range is going to be weighted towards draws. if you often wait until the turn with good hands here, waiting until the turn with draws will work much better for you than it will for me

yourface · #16 10-09-2007, 07:14 PM

oh yah, note how I say 'perceptive villain'
if your villain is oblivious just be as exploitive as possible. some guys will call down your flop raises all day but get scared when facing a turn raise no matter what hands you are representing, so abuse them

sethypooh21 · #17 10-09-2007, 08:03 PM

[ QUOTE ]
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I think you have more FE if you raise the turn vs. LAGTAG. Flop raise in this spot screams "I has a draw" and though a lot of draws got there, spades missed and he's getting 8-1.

I mean, once you get there, sure fire the river - doesn't have to work that often, plus you get paid off when you have JJ/KQ here in the future.

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if you play good aggressive poker like yourface then raising the turn looks like you picked up a huge draw a lot more than it looks like you have AT.

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Are we raising this flop with AT? Really?

Anyway, lol at having much FE in this spot vs. even a semi-thinking lagtag, especially if you are aggro like yourface.

vmacosta · #18 10-09-2007, 09:31 PM

"Are we raising this flop with AT? Really?"

yeah. its the only way i really know how to play a decent pair there.

*occasionally* i wait and raise the river if i'm in a bad mood and am willing to sacrifice a little ev for the satisfaction of possibly owning an overagro ahole.

what do you do with AT? k9? 76?

milesdyson · #19 10-09-2007, 09:36 PM

i'd raise AT for sure. perfect action board ie. i don't feel like crap calling down a 3-bet because he can easily have KT QT JT or a draw himself.

the river is a heisenberg spot. you obviously have to 3-barrel here because it is such a perfect card to represent. so it does not surprise me that he called. you could also have A8,A7,K8,K7, K high FD as well, and you'd likely check behind something like J9 (not fully expecting him to call AJ/AK high).

yourface · #20 10-09-2007, 09:44 PM

you guys raise gutshots on this flop?