I would NOT do God's will if he were immoral

[surftheiop]

Well im pretty sure those are the christian definitions of god and it seems most religous debate centers around the christian god

[Sephus]

[ QUOTE ]
Well im pretty sure those are the christian definitions of god and it seems most religous debate centers around the christian god

[/ QUOTE ]

the "christian god" comes down from heaven and says "hey guys. it turns out that when i implied there was something inherently wrong about lying, i was putting one over on you. i actually lied a lot. i had good reasons for doing it though."

all the christians hang their heads in shame, admitting: "well we were wrong. turns out god doesn't exist after all..."

when a christian says "god can't lie" they're describing god, they're not defining the word.

[rebuyboy]

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First, let's say god tells me that the new Jesus will be born if I rape some woman who would not otherwise have sex with me. I would absolutely not do that, under any circumstances.


[/ QUOTE ]

what if she was really really hot

[chezlaw]

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wow you suck at logic

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seems unlikely but pray tell

[MaxWeiss]

I used that exact example on purpose to make the point that if it rested on humanity's salvation, god could and SHOULD do it the way he did before, or at least in some other non-violent way. He's GOD after all, right? So he should be able to find another way. And it's very wrong of him to force two people to hurt themselves when there's another way and he knows it.

[MaxWeiss]

[ QUOTE ]
"imperfect in power or imperfect in love. "

Unless he willingly does not fully utilize his power in order to allow his creation free will. And if he is omniscient then he knows that it is better to have free will and evil than no free will and no evil.

[/ QUOTE ]

Why?? Just to see what we'll do??? Although I like my free will, I don't see how it is in any way inherently better than none, in god's eyes.

[hitch1978]

"he knows that it is better to have free will and evil than no free will and no evil. "

Why do you believe this?

[Splendour]

Puppet love isn't really love at all, but love freely given is to be greatly prized.

[MaxWeiss]

Actually, as Sephus noted, it was a reference to Abraham and Isaac, not Jesus. Jesus was just a big scapegoat. Do you really think it's moral to allow for somebody else to forgive your actions, whatever you may have done??? And further, to forgive them solely by having himself tortured and killed??? How is that right by any definition?? Also, couldn't god find a better way to forgive rather than have his son tortured and killed???

I don't see it as the fireman example you set above. I see it as the father sending in the son whenever anybody else starts a fire and also when there are other ways to stop the fire which save everybody inside but also put no fireman at risk. There's no NEED to send in the son in the first place, and it's wrong to ask him to do so in the first case, and much more wrong to do so when you (as god) could come up with another way which harms no one.

[bunny]

This is my position also and (needless to say) I think it's the moral one.