Live 5/5 game, semi deep. - Page 3

Clayton · #21 03-21-2007, 08:15 AM

oh i raise the flop to 675

RERAISE5823 · #22 03-21-2007, 08:21 AM

[ QUOTE ]
because you just called off 23bb with a purely speculative hand against a solid player whose range here should be wider than AA/KK

23bb coldcalls with 87s (granted it's more a 5-10bb mistake) aren't just something you can chalk up to image/position etc, because mistakes in nlhe escalate. Do you just c/f a 7 high flop? Do you just raise if you flop a pure flush draw? Jesus just get yourself out of this mess - you've got 8-high and it's 23 more bb. Let him have this one.

[/ QUOTE ]

Noted, but no, I'd rather spank the flop or give him $160. Also, his range is nearly exactly what I described. I put him on AA, KK after the flop, p.e.r.i.o.d.

TY for the well thought out response, though. It is appreciated and folding is certainly not a bad play.

I guess I'll stop posting hands in the future. It seems people get very caught up with preflop and don't see how interesting post flop play can be. Also, not too many of you guys play live, and you don't realize how very different the game is (not you lapoker). Just my opinion.

Sorry, thought this hand was pretty interesting.

Peace...

Zeestein · #23 03-21-2007, 08:47 AM

jesus, it's 87s and it's 23bb more. I know you're deep, the pot odds aren fairly attractive and that you have the villain on a narrow range, but have you thought about what you're doing on 8-high flops and with flush draws/gutshots/where you miss totally/where you raise and is called?

Having got there raising flop is ok but I like calling better, both looks really strong. I'd bet 1/2 pot on a blank turn and shove any non-K/A river if he calls the turn and checks river.

Also wtf - are you after advice or do you want a medal for making a straight vs AA after calling off 32bb preflop with 87s? I think preflop is really bad, the flop is good (in that calling is better than raising imo). Now you just go nuts having made your hand on the turn.

RERAISE5823 · #24 03-21-2007, 09:30 AM

[ QUOTE ]
jesus, it's 87s and it's 23bb more. I know you're deep, the pot odds aren fairly attractive and that you have the villain on a narrow range, but have you thought about what you're doing on 8-high flops and with flush draws/gutshots/where you miss totally/where you raise and is called?

Having got there raising flop is ok but I like calling better, both looks really strong. I'd bet 1/2 pot on a blank turn and shove any non-K/A river if he calls the turn and checks river.

Also wtf - are you after advice or do you want a medal for making a straight vs AA after calling off 32bb preflop with 87s? I think preflop is really bad, the flop is good (in that calling is better than raising imo). Now you just go nuts having made your hand on the turn.

[/ QUOTE ]

LOL I'm less concerned with recieving a medal than I am recieving all of BB's chips. This hand is interesting because it's possible to raise each street, but what play yields the best return?

To answer your question, I will likely fold an 8 high flop, unless it's like 8 [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 6h 4 [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]. That's the only type of flop that could possibly get me in a heap of trouble. Maybe 10-15% of the time I'll raise the flop on a bluff regardless of texture.

So what I'm trying to determine is do I raise/shove the turn or smoothcall again?

TheWorstPlayer · #25 03-21-2007, 09:36 AM

OMG, preflop is so standard - wtf are you guys smoking. And I'd raise the flop because you're deep and want to get all in. Something kinda small (largely as a pot builder to take it from his AK/AA on the turn). He'll fold anything weaker than AK on the flop even to a small raise, most likely.

RERAISE5823 · #26 03-21-2007, 09:40 AM

[ QUOTE ]
OMG, preflop is so standard - wtf are you guys smoking. And I'd raise the flop because you're deep and want to get all in. Something kinda small (largely as a pot builder to take it from his AK/AA on the turn). He'll fold anything weaker than AK on the flop even to a small raise, most likely.

[/ QUOTE ]

I completely agree, except don't we want to hit and stack him here some % of the time?

Oh wait, you have the JMan avatar. I guess I'll have to eat my words since I regard you as a solid player.

TheWorstPlayer · #27 03-21-2007, 10:03 AM

Yes, that's our fall-back plan. And thanks for the compliment. Anyone without the avatar is passing up some solid EV, IMO.

RERAISE5823 · #28 03-21-2007, 10:32 AM

[ QUOTE ]
Yes, that's our fall-back plan. And thanks for the compliment. Anyone without the avatar is passing up some solid EV, IMO.

[/ QUOTE ]

Your prolly right (about the JMan thing), but I haven't played online much in a while. Can't move money around. Play 5/5 or 5/10 Live 20hrs a week as a serious hobby at the moment.

Hopefully the online landscape will improve and I will come back.