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#1
07-20-2007, 11:00 PM
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The Current Islamic Reformation
I just finished listening to an awesome lecture/talk by Reza Aslan about the current state of Islam in the world. For those of you who don't know, he is a religious scholar who has written a book and many articles on the current state of Islam. He is also one of the moderate Muslims who is always speaking out in the media.
You can download the talk off of iTunes for free if you go to Stanford on iTunes at http://itunes.stanford.edu/. Click on Arts and Humanities, then go to Spirituality and Religion. He gives a really sophisticated view of what is going on in the Islamic world right now. His basic thesis is that globalization is making the traditional institutional authorities in Islam become more and more irrelevant. Instead, it is becoming increasingly easier for Muslims to come to their own conclusions and to search for alternative interpretations of their religion. Apparently there is no hierarchy in Islam with regard to who can interpret scripture. There is no pope-like figure. Traditionally, Muslims scholars (imams) who devoted their lives to studying the Koran were the spiritual leaders, but they didn't really have much authority in the usual sense. They were just the guys who had the knowledge, similar to the Protestant idea of clergy where anyone who gains the requisite knowledge is can be ordained but there isn't a central authority. These figures were especially powerful since the Koran is usually read in the original Arabic and translations of the text are seen as theological interpretations of the holy text. So traditionally, the imams had a lot of power simply because they were the only way to get information about Islam. If you have a question about how you are supposed to practice your faith, you'd go to your local imam and he'd give you his interpretation. You couldn't really get alternate viewpoints. In recent times, the Koran has become translated into many more languages and Muslim immigration has seen different types of Muslims coming together in the same community. Also the rise of the internet has made it possible for people to seek out alternate interpretations of Islam from various imams and Islamic theologians from around the world. This is similar to the Protestant Reformation in that it is a rejection of the traditional hierarchy and a return to individualism in faith. Aslan compares Jihadism and Osama bin Laden to Puritanism. Basically they preach that Muslims should return to a purified form of Islam that is free from all the modern and secular "bastardizations" of the true religion. They use anti-institutional appeals to sway Muslims around the world who are yearning for a more individualistic form of Islam. In Aslan's view, their vision of what Islam used to be is a fantastical and imaginary caricature of the origins of the faith. However, he sees them as a troubling, but understandable wing of this revamping of Islam. Anyway, it's a real interesting listen if you are at all interested in what is going on in the Islamic world. IMO, it should be required to listen to it as an alternate viewpoint on what all this Jihadism is actually about. 
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#2
07-21-2007, 12:08 AM
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Re: The Current Islamic Reformation
[ QUOTE ]
Anyway, it's a real interesting listen if you are at all interested in what is going on in the Islamic world [/ QUOTE ] I hope what you say he said is right. I listened to about 15 minutes and couldn't go any further because: 1. He lumped Hezbollah and Hamas, and others, into the War on Terror - and he got a little silly by asking how you declare war on a technique (not unlike Edwards and his bumper sticker idiocy) - but I think most of us know what the phrase means and who the war is against. 2. He was WAY off base to toss Martin Luther into the mix. The other 3 he mentioned I'm not familiar with - Thomas Munster was the only name I could make out, and google didn't produce anything. 3. Comparing militant Islam to Puritanism or the Reformation is just wrong. Some reformers committed some violence but even there the difference is obvious and profound. Anyway, I don't really want to debate the issue and like I said I do hope fanatical Islam will dissipate.
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#3
07-21-2007, 04:27 AM
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Re: The Current Islamic Reformation
I think you misunderstood him a bit. He kept trying to throw in caveats to say that he wasn't trying to compare Christianity with Islam and that he was just trying to explain it in terms people are more familiar with. He even made a joke about how he realizes that it's hard to follow up after comparing Luther to Bin Laden.
[ QUOTE ] 1. He lumped Hezbollah and Hamas, and others, into the War on Terror - and he got a little silly by asking how you declare war on a technique (not unlike Edwards and his bumper sticker idiocy) - but I think most of us know what the phrase means and who the war is against. [/ QUOTE ] He was trying to point out that the various groups we lump together in the "War on Terror" are vastly different. By putting them in the same group we are grossly misinterpreting the intricacies of the situation and how to best handle each group. Just because they use the same tactics doesn't mean that we can fight the same war against them. [ QUOTE ] 2. He was WAY off base to toss Martin Luther into the mix. The other 3 he mentioned I'm not familiar with - Thomas Munster was the only name I could make out, and google didn't produce anything. [/ QUOTE ] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thomas_Muentzer I think you're misunderstanding him. He was making the analogy that Luther was against the prevailing Christian authority and that a similar thing is going on in the Muslim world. [ QUOTE ] 3. Comparing militant Islam to Puritanism or the Reformation is just wrong. Some reformers committed some violence but even there the difference is obvious and profound. [/ QUOTE ] Again, I believe you're misunderstanding what he's saying. He isn't saying militant Islam is like the Protestant Reformation. He is saying that Islam is being reformed in a way similar to what happened in the Reformation and that Jihadism is one of the branches that has shot off in this new reformation. And he is only comparing Jihadism with Puritanism in terms of ideals of returning to a 'purer' form of the religion. I don't remember him mentioning anything concrete about the violence. [ QUOTE ] Anyway, I don't really want to debate the issue and like I said I do hope fanatical Islam will dissipate. [/ QUOTE ] I sort of new that some people would take his words the way you did and I just hope to clarify the situation a little bit. He is just framing the situation in terms we all are more familiar with. Protestantism was a reaction against the prevailing form of Christianity. A similar movement is occurring in Islam, but the Jihadists aren't this entire movement. Think of the Jihadists as the Branch Davidians or something like that.
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#4
07-21-2007, 05:08 AM
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Re: The Current Islamic Reformation
[ QUOTE ]
Anyway, it's a real interesting listen if you are at all interested in what is going on in the Islamic world. IMO, it should be required to listen to it as an alternate viewpoint on what all this Jihadism is actually about. [/ QUOTE ] It's long, but interesting: Sam Harris v Reza Aslan debate The server seems to be acting up on the site associated with the above link. Here's the download link (right click/ save target link as...): download
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#5
07-21-2007, 05:37 AM
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Re: The Current Islamic Reformation
[ QUOTE ]
It's long, but interesting: Sam Harris v Reza Aslan debate The server seems to be acting up on the site associated with the above link. Here's the download link (right click/ save target link as...): download [/ QUOTE ] I remember this debate was posted before. It's also quite interesting but I felt that they were talking past each other most of the time. They would each make a point while ignoring the other's last point.
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#9
07-26-2007, 03:24 AM
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Re: The Current Islamic Reformation
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] As soon as I saw that I had to be a Stanford student to hear the talk, I tuned out. [/ QUOTE ] You don't have to be. It's free on iTunes. [/ QUOTE ] Oops! I completely misread this: [ QUOTE ] You can download the talk off of iTunes for free if you go to Stanford on iTunes at http://itunes.stanford.edu/. Click on Arts and Humanities, then go to Spirituality and Religion. [/ QUOTE ]
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#10
07-27-2007, 01:41 AM
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Re: The Current Islamic Reformation
Well, I listened to it, and I definitely enjoyed it. Much of what he said reminds me of things I've read from Karen Armstrong.
Aslan makes an excellent case for Islam being in a state of flux similar to the Christian Reformation and no matter what NR says, the comparison of Bin Laden and Muester, Luther, et al. is appropriate (if he bothered to keep listening for a couple more minutes Aslan would have explained what he meant). I guess I'm one of those guys who hears "Islamic Reformation" and immediately thinks of a modern, liberal Islam rising from the ashes. Aslan makes it clear though that this isn't necessarily what will happen. We're still much too early in the process to see what will come out. My real fear is the thought of a 21st century Islamic equivalent of the 30 Years War. That would be hideously brutal.
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