the river donk

[rafiki]

I say go up to 5 bets. Then say "nh"

:P

[MitchL]

I would say easy fold had I not been in the game, but his demeanor when he bet the river screamed bluff so I would have ended up calling probably. Trouble is that since he was the original raiser we can only beat like 2 hands in his range. Also, I have played with this guy and he is a showdown monkey so a raise will accomplish nothing unless he calls w/ AQ, though it might be worth it just for the sheer joy of that scenario.

[private joker]

[ QUOTE ]
I would say easy fold had I not been in the game, but his demeanor when he bet the river screamed bluff so I would have ended up calling probably. Trouble is that since he was the original raiser we can only beat like 2 hands in his range. Also, I have played with this guy and he is a showdown monkey so a raise will accomplish nothing unless he calls w/ AQ, though it might be worth it just for the sheer joy of that scenario.

[/ QUOTE ]

What about raising him off another AK?

[MitchL]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
I would say easy fold had I not been in the game, but his demeanor when he bet the river screamed bluff so I would have ended up calling probably. Trouble is that since he was the original raiser we can only beat like 2 hands in his range. Also, I have played with this guy and he is a showdown monkey so a raise will accomplish nothing unless he calls w/ AQ, though it might be worth it just for the sheer joy of that scenario.

[/ QUOTE ]

What about raising him off another AK?

[/ QUOTE ]

I suppose that if we give him AK, AQ, KQ, and maybe sprinkle in a couple of pps (dont think he is totally incapable of folding) then a raise could be worth it, but he gets a real determined-suspicious look when he plays a pot head up, which almost works to advantage, bc it makes it seem like he is sd bound every time.

[private joker]

[ QUOTE ]


I suppose that if we give him AK, AQ, KQ, and maybe sprinkle in a couple of pps (dont think he is totally incapable of folding) then a raise could be worth it, but he gets a real determined-suspicious look when he plays a pot head up, which almost works to advantage, bc it makes it seem like he is sd bound every time.

[/ QUOTE ]

Well, I still argue for a fold since after his river donk the pot has 7.5 BBs; therefore we're getting 7.5:2 or not even 4:1 on our bluff. So to raise, we need to think he folds a better hand or has a worse hand over 20% of the time. If we call, then he has to have specifically a worse hand, but he only has to have it 12% of the time. Both of these cases are on the optimistic side, so it's probably a close fold. Put 2 more BBs in the pot and I like a raise.

[PokerBob]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]


I suppose that if we give him AK, AQ, KQ, and maybe sprinkle in a couple of pps (dont think he is totally incapable of folding) then a raise could be worth it, but he gets a real determined-suspicious look when he plays a pot head up, which almost works to advantage, bc it makes it seem like he is sd bound every time.

[/ QUOTE ]

Well, I still argue for a fold since after his river donk the pot has 7.5 BBs; therefore we're getting 7.5:2 or not even 4:1 on our bluff. So to raise, we need to think he folds a better hand or has a worse hand over 20% of the time. If we call, then he has to have specifically a worse hand, but he only has to have it 12% of the time. Both of these cases are on the optimistic side, so it's probably a close fold. Put 2 more BBs in the pot and I like a raise.

[/ QUOTE ]

i 3bet preflop and bb called (9sb). i bet the flop and got called in 2 spots(12sb). i bet the turn and utg called (8sb). when the action is to me on the river, there are 9bb in the pot.

[cgrohman]

I usually find the river donk by bad players to me a made-draw or a busted draw. E.g. last time I played, UTG donkey raised J10s. I 3 bet AK, K9x on the flop. UTG checked/called bets on flop and turn. Sudddenly he donks river. He had a gutshot which he missed.

Unfortunately, here, ever draw in creation was completed on the rivrr unless maybe he had KQ. So you gots to fold imo.

[blindside]

how is this anything but a fold?

[danzasmack]

[ QUOTE ]
Well, I think raising the river is better than calling it, at least.

[/ QUOTE ]

100% with this. Esp. if the dude has sunglasses on. Then flash your hand and say "nice fold". When he looks confused tell him that the cards were too bright maybe next time can you borrow his specs to double check his hand before you raise him.

Plus if I raise and get called here me showing my hand will usually make me back a bet or 2 in the long run.

[private joker]

[ QUOTE ]
how is this anything but a fold?

[/ QUOTE ]

Did you read the thread?