College v. Pro

[soapstar]

Not a chance in the world, ever.

[MCS]

[ QUOTE ]
Could the winner of March Madness beat an NBA team?

[/ QUOTE ]

Once in a thousand times, sure.

[tdarko]

Jack White,

You say, "Take a look at the lines of any major college team. You will see many 300+ pounders." Um, ok? I never said there weren't big men in college, of course there are, but the average line weight in the NFL is all 300 pounders and 300 pounders that are the quickest, strongest, and most powerful guys; the guys that made it to the next level. They would dominate the college line that is overall undersized, less powerful, quick, and skilled. This is just a fact.

You talk about Lions recievers dropping passes right to them, well when the game speeds up it gets a hell of a lot tougher, so all of those Detroit Lions players you curse when they screw up once dominated every DB they met in college, they had less to worry about.

I was once told by a guy I know (he plays in the NFL) that there are 3 speeds to the NFL: There is preseason, regular season and playoffs and each magnifies the previous by an amount that he couldn't explain, he said you have to experience it to understand it. He also said that no matter what kind of NCAA schedule you played, how many games, or what you did in college, nothing can prepare you for this, it is a completely different atmosphere. Experience is the only remedy. So these college guys with their great RA RA chemistry would get destroyed by the better NFL coaches and the better NFL players. Sure if they played a million times (or something unreasonable) they might win a game but that isn't the question.

~td

[dkgojackets]

[ QUOTE ]
Could a college baseball team beat a MLB team?(I think the gap may be closer in baseball than NBA or NFL. I think NFL has the widest gap, imo)

b

[/ QUOTE ]

I know its happened in spring training before. I dont know about vs. and everyday regular-season MLB team, but depending on pitching matchups it is possible.

[JackWhite]

[ QUOTE ]
ack White,

You say, "Take a look at the lines of any major college team. You will see many 300+ pounders." Um, ok? I never said there weren't big men in college, of course there are, but the average line weight in the NFL is all 300 pounders and 300 pounders that are the quickest, strongest, and most powerful guys; the guys that made it to the next level. They would dominate the college line that is overall undersized, less powerful, quick, and skilled. This is just a fact.

You talk about Lions recievers dropping passes right to them, well when the game speeds up it gets a hell of a lot tougher, so all of those Detroit Lions players you curse when they screw up once dominated every DB they met in college, they had less to worry about.

I was once told by a guy I know (he plays in the NFL) that there are 3 speeds to the NFL: There is preseason, regular season and playoffs and each magnifies the previous by an amount that he couldn't explain, he said you have to experience it to understand it. He also said that no matter what kind of NCAA schedule you played, how many games, or what you did in college, nothing can prepare you for this, it is a completely different atmosphere. Experience is the only remedy. So these college guys with their great RA RA chemistry would get destroyed by the better NFL coaches and the better NFL players. Sure if they played a million times (or something unreasonable) they might win a game but that isn't the question.

~td

[/ QUOTE ]

I am not questioning the physical superiority of the NFL players. The question was, could a great college team have a chance under the right circumstances. For you guys to say it is impossible, that means that the NFL team would have to be at least a 35+ point favorite at a minimum. If USC played the Texans last year, would Houston be over a 35+ favorite?

As far as your point about watching the Lions play horrible football. If a receiver drops a pass when he is wide open, I am not sure if I can attribute that to him worrying about more things. Maybe there are guys who get a fat paycheck, then go into the tank. We've all seen it happen.

Upsets happen in football all the time. One of the reasons is motivation. We see a 17 point dog win a game. How does it happen? Maybe they practiced like dogs all week and were super pumped to play, while the favorite walked through practice and assumed they'd win just by showing up.


To jump to another sport, did you watch the USA basketball team at the Olympics in 2004? That team was made up of NBA all-stars, with a few feature Hall of Famers, and we lost to teams comprised of only a few NBA players, and a bunch of guys we've never heard of who weren't good enough to be in the NBA.

The US team was unbelievably phsyically superior, yet had bad team chemistry and a lack of motivation. A team comprised of Tim Duncan, Allen Iverson, Dwayne Wade, Lebron James, Amare Stoudemire, Carmelo Anthony etc...lost to a bunch of guys we've never heard of.

I know football is a lot differenct thank basketball, I just think the talent level, at least on the offensive side of the ball between the 2005 Houston Texans and the USC Trojans is not that great. Convince me why Leinart, Bush, White, Smith, Jarrett and company weren't anywhere near the talent of the Houston Texans.

[Magisastar]

Im not really a football fan, but surely the Pro quarterback would throw pretty well, knowing he had almost zero chance of getting sacked. The Pro Offensive line would be too strong. They would rush for plenty, and passing completion would be way way up.

On the other had, the college quarterback would be getting beat down all day, and the team would be lucky to rush for 50 yards.

[tdarko]

[ QUOTE ]
To jump to another sport, did you watch the USA basketball team at the Olympics in 2004? That team was made up of NBA all-stars, with a few feature Hall of Famers, and we lost to teams comprised of only a few NBA players, and a bunch of guys we've never heard of who weren't good enough to be in the NBA.

The US team was unbelievably phsyically superior, yet had bad team chemistry and a lack of motivation. A team comprised of Tim Duncan, Allen Iverson, Dwayne Wade, Lebron James, Amare Stoudemire, Carmelo Anthony etc...lost to a bunch of guys we've never heard of.

[/ QUOTE ]

First off, this isn't really a very good example. We have exhausted this topic in this forum and I think you are missing why that team failed. The USA players were playing against teams that have been together for years, different rules all of the sudden thrown at them and to be honest, though there was great players, the make-up of the team was terrible, there were no role players, no defense, nobody seemed to really care. This is way different than what we are talking about. That basketball team was comprised of every NBA teams superstar, so when the O-games rolled along there simply weren't enough FG's to spread amongst the team, and the game became choppy and the European style took over completely. We can talk about this for an entire thread if you want but I don't believe this is what the thread is about, again, bad analogy.

[ QUOTE ]
I am not questioning the physical superiority of the NFL players. The question was, could a great college team have a chance under the right circumstances. For you guys to say it is impossible, that means that the NFL team would have to be at least a 35+ point favorite at a minimum. If USC played the Texans last year, would Houston be over a 35+ favorite?

[/ QUOTE ]

Well, I know for a fact that the Texans of last year were better than USC, so then yes they would be greater than a 35+ favorite to win. I also know that they were better than Texas as well. You mention 4 or 5 guys (on the USC team) at the end of your post as if that is all that it takes to beat an NFL team. Maybe you should be reminded that only one of those guys has even a "chance" at being successful/dominant in the NFL his first year or first game, since it would be all of these teeny bobbers and young twenty somethings first game against HOF'ers and veterans. The the other forty plus guys on the team, what about them? The guys that are too slow to block for these guys, or too slow or not powerful to stop an NFL team on downs? Remember it is a team game, not a 4 man show, and the NFL team has an entire TEAM of guys like the 4-5 you mention. That is the difference. I still can't believe you are trying to argue that this would even be close.

I have seen professional baseball teams (not Major League--not even close actually) intrasquad college teams before, and baseball is more of a variance game than football and these were absolute blow-outs. Everyone knew they were going to be, the players were just getting tuned up for their season etc., but it wasn't even close.

[JackWhite]

[ QUOTE ]
Well, I know for a fact that the Texans of last year were better than USC, so then yes they would be greater than a 35+ favorite to win.

[/ QUOTE ]

So if a team is better than another, is equates to at least a 35 point spread? I have no doubt the Texans were better, but we are arguing by how much. In your previous post you were talking about how NFL teams had superior coaching and could resort to different levels of speed, such as "playoff speed." Did the 2005 Texans have "superior coaching?" Did they often resort to that NFL "playoff speed?" If so, why the ungodly horrible performance? Maybe they lacked playoff speed and superior coaching? ..among other things. Just a guess here.

[JackWhite]

[ QUOTE ]
Im not really a football fan, but surely the Pro quarterback would throw pretty well, knowing he had almost zero chance of getting sacked. The Pro Offensive line would be too strong.

[/ QUOTE ]

To be fair, I was talking about a game involving the Houston Texans. They are not known for protecting the quarterback and avoiding sacks. I might be able to get a sack against their O-line.

[tdarko]

[ QUOTE ]
In your previous post you were talking about how NFL teams had superior coaching and could resort to different levels of speed, such as "playoff speed."

[/ QUOTE ]

Maybe you mistook what I said and/or I wasn't clear, I "guess" that is my fault. My friend told me that the GAME speeds have three different levels not the players, playoff games were played at a pace faster than reg. games and so on, which is expected, but his point was how drastic of a difference it was and how preseason was difficult in itself.

If you think NFL coaches aren't superior to college coaches you are mistaken. Yes, there are some great college coaches and some great ones that are NFL caliber, especially since they were successful NFL coaches (or even marginally successful), but to think that NFL coaches don't have the edge in coaching is to be mistaken.

[ QUOTE ]
Did the 2005 Texans have "superior coaching?" Did they often resort to that NFL "playoff speed?" If so, why the ungodly horrible performance? Maybe they lacked playoff speed and superior coaching? ..among other things. Just a guess here.

[/ QUOTE ]

For most of this just reread the top of this post. As for their bad performance, well, they are playing against other NFL teams, not college teams, you realize this right? Just b/c the Texans aren't superior against other NFL teams means dick when comparing them to college football.