Home game ruling - was this guy a douche?

[EasilyFound]

In my home game, if a player at showdown mucks his hand (meaning that the cards are thrown into the muck face down so nobody sees them), I do not require the other player to show a hand to be awarded the pot. In other words, a player can surrender a pot at showdown.

The rule at showdown is cards speak, regardless of what anyone says. If one player's cards are shown, another player cannot be awarded the pot without showing his or her cards.

I'd be happy to hear what other people do if they follow a different rule.

[psandman]

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If he says "I fold" then I wait for the hand to be put in the muck. But "take it" isn't the same thing, but is similar to "you got it" which also isn't a fold.

I did this once when I was new at my cardroom job. Someone angrily threw his hand face up into the board. I mucked it. All hell broke loose.

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Actually now that I think about it further, I Have some players who tell me to "take it" when they want me to muck there cards, I guess if he said "take it" directed to the dealer I could understand how the dealer might think this is direction to take the hand and muck it.

[Lottery Larry]

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Tabled hand, cards speak. Could have said he had the SF, dosen't matter. Cards speak if they are tabled.

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What if he had said "I fold" but other actions were the same?

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You can't fold if you've paid the money at the end. Cards speak- Adolf pushed, he's in the hand. He showed his cards, they were winners, take down the pot and smack the baby deer in the head.

[Arp220]

Very interesting, thanks for the feedback. Not what I initially thought it should be, but it does make sense now. Or maybe Adolf just pissed me off as he spent the evening acting like he was phil ivey but playing like a lobotomized squirrel [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

[Lottery Larry]

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Or maybe Adolf just pissed me off as he spent the evening acting like he was phil ivey but playing like a lobotomized squirrel [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

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Hey, you shouldn't focus on getting irritated. Focus on getting a custom chair built for the rodent.... and stock his favorite drink.

[Ramjet]

I would have also voted for the weaker player to win the pot...

[Small Fry]

I'm going to delete what was originally here and replace it. After rereading the Op I realized this was a tourney in which case an all in player cannot fold. His hand must be tabled.

My mistake. Sorry for creating some confusion

[Lottery Larry]

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I want to make sure I get this correct because I'm surprised. (if "let's go" = "call" (B&M forum) then surely "take it" can = "fold". Or maybe not?)

1. Adolf says "take it" and throws his cards forward into the center of the table. What is the ruling regarding his hand at this point?

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Read the OP again:
" River is an ace. Bambi checks, Adolf goes all in"

Adolf can no longer "fold" his hand, only be beaten by a better hand. Now, if he threw his cards into the muck as unidentifiable, and not having exposed them.... or maybe if he DID expose them, then maybe you could consider his hand folded if they'd hit the muck... but I'd want a strong written rule around it.

I'd give Adolf a KITN if he did throw them into the muck (you have to worry about the collusion angle here).

The rest is just noise.

[pfapfap]

I think Larry is making a distinction between folding and mucking, further obfuscating the issue.

I chatted with those in the know at the cardroom this morning. I'd like to amend my previous statement and say that "I fold" while tabling a hand does not concede the pot, no more than saying "I have a straight flush" while tabling 7-high can transform the tabled hand.

I think in the past I've mucked hands that were tabled and pushed towards me with "I fold" or something similar, but it so rarely happens. I'll be on the lookout in the future and not muck a hand if it's tabled, regardless of what's said.

In short, tabling a hand locks it.

[jeffnc]

There is no such thing as a "fold" after the river bet has been called.

Adolf wins the pot. Bambi goofed by not simply waiting for the dealer to much Adolf's cards and slide the pot to Bambi. At that point Bambi can quietly much his cards.