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  #11  
Old 09-12-2007, 08:14 PM
dlpnyc21 dlpnyc21 is offline
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Default Re: Calldown in a reraised pot, 25/50 live v. a capable bluffer

[ QUOTE ]
i think calling is ok against the villian u describe, but by raising to 6xBB preflop u put urself in an ugly spot. i prefer either limping or making it 3xBB, this makes the hand much easier to play

[/ QUOTE ]

this is an excellent post. thanks.
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  #12  
Old 09-12-2007, 08:27 PM
SlowHabit SlowHabit is offline
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Default Re: Calldown in a reraised pot, 25/50 live v. a capable bluffer

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
i think calling is ok against the villian u describe, but by raising to 6xBB preflop u put urself in an ugly spot. i prefer either limping or making it 3xBB, this makes the hand much easier to play

[/ QUOTE ]

this is an excellent post. thanks.

[/ QUOTE ]
I can't tell if this is sarcasm or not, especially after the Ansky incident [img]/images/graemlins/cool.gif[/img]
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  #13  
Old 09-12-2007, 08:28 PM
SlowHabit SlowHabit is offline
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Default Re: Calldown in a reraised pot, 25/50 live v. a capable bluffer

Almost every time I call here, I just sit there and wonder wtf just happened.
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  #14  
Old 09-12-2007, 08:32 PM
Perestroika Perestroika is offline
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Default Re: Calldown in a reraised pot, 25/50 live v. a capable bluffer

Sarcasm all day.
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  #15  
Old 09-12-2007, 08:32 PM
dlpnyc21 dlpnyc21 is offline
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Default Re: Calldown in a reraised pot, 25/50 live v. a capable bluffer

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
i think calling is ok against the villian u describe, but by raising to 6xBB preflop u put urself in an ugly spot. i prefer either limping or making it 3xBB, this makes the hand much easier to play

[/ QUOTE ]

this is an excellent post. thanks.

[/ QUOTE ]
I can't tell if this is sarcasm or not, especially after the Ansky incident [img]/images/graemlins/cool.gif[/img]

[/ QUOTE ]

not sarcasm at all...it's a weird thing in deepstack live games like this--what chaos might/might not realize is that if i raise to 3xbb i will get called by nearly everyone, 5-6xbb raises are far more standard, but yet, if I raise to 3xbb and get called by nearly everyone it's actually quite a good result for my hand. i think 3xbb or limping is by far better with my stack--if i was sitting on 50kish it would be an easier 6xbb raise.
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  #16  
Old 09-12-2007, 08:47 PM
Perestroika Perestroika is offline
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Default Re: Calldown in a reraised pot, 25/50 live v. a capable bluffer

You said his range is polar i.e- K+/air. A few questions then that will help me understand this spot.

How often do you just flat call with a set in similar reraised situations as opposed to just calling with middling pairs, straight draws in this type of reraised situation?

Follow up question. To what extent does villain perceive your tendencies. I think if he has a strong grasp of where your sitting this is a fold (unless of course you can deduce from his mannerism's otherwise). I do hesitate to say clear fold though because I cannot enumerate the weight of your physical tells to my mental picture of your EV in this situation. For what its worth I love calling in neutral EV situations here, but I sometimes analyze poker to massage my ego.

Final question and this is for all the community. In your opinion, how often do overpot bets equal= air, value bets, semi-bluffs? In my live game (2-5) overbets such as these tend to be strongish made hands that are worried about being outplayed, obviously this may have no bearing on hero's position but I believe would be interesting to hear others perspectives.
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  #17  
Old 09-12-2007, 10:14 PM
Flatlanman3 Flatlanman3 is offline
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Default Re: Calldown in a reraised pot, 25/50 live v. a capable bluffer

Does anyone else think its worth analyzing why he bet 10k and not 11k even though he asked for a count?
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  #18  
Old 09-12-2007, 10:20 PM
FoxwoodsFiend FoxwoodsFiend is offline
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Default Re: Calldown in a reraised pot, 25/50 live v. a capable bluffer

[ QUOTE ]
Almost every time I call here, I just sit there and wonder wtf just happened.

[/ QUOTE ]

exactly what i was thinking, couldn't have said it better myself
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  #19  
Old 09-13-2007, 01:51 AM
AdamBragar AdamBragar is offline
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Default Re: Calldown in a reraised pot, 25/50 live v. a capable bluffer

I actually think preflop bet sizing is a huge consideration in a game like this that I definitely don't think about enough when I play live. Raising so big with a midpocket seems like it's going to put you in tons of awkward spots. Raising to 200 seems like it might protect against a bunch of limpers and someone making some ridiculous raise in LP. Depending on how the game is playing, I like limping or a small raise pre.

Also, preflop, do you 4 bet with AA, KK or QQ here? How about AK? With these stack sizes, I might consider making it 5.5k or so because calling with 88 gives you so many flops that become terrible to play.

Given your reads and the board, I'm getting my money in. It would suck if he had 99.
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  #20  
Old 09-13-2007, 05:55 AM
tsarast tsarast is offline
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Default Re: Calldown in a reraised pot, 25/50 live v. a capable bluffer

if he knows you stack off with any King, then I think this is a fold. my guess is he has two aces. Almost any pro here has AK, KK, or AA every time... the quick action is usually a reverse tell trying to make you think they are bluffing. I see pros do that all the time live. Unless you know otherwise... INTO THE MUCK!!!
I personally think you should have folded the flop, and given the size of his reraise preflop as well fwiw. I think 20k is minimum to make this call preflop, esp. since it looks like he stacks off with AA if you flop a set. Calling 1300 more is on the thin side with 1600, especially if you include air in his range (ie he doesnt stack off).
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