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  #1  
Old 11-10-2007, 08:40 AM
Mason Malmuth Mason Malmuth is offline
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Default Winning in Tough Hold \'em Games

Hi Everyone:

I'm going to be accused of just trying to sell books, but that's not the case. Even though we have now sold a fair number of Winning in Tough Hold 'em Games by Nick "Stoxtrader" Grudzien and Geoff "Zobags" Herzog, almost 15,000 at this point in time, I think that many of you are missing out. It contains some of the most dynamic material we have ever published, and I have been working with it to improve my own limit play.

It's not an easy book, and to really benefit from it will require some study. But for those who make this effort, it will be worth it.

Best wishes,
Mason
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  #2  
Old 11-10-2007, 09:40 AM
Doc T River Doc T River is offline
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Default Re: Winning in Tough Hold \'em Games

I have not gotten the book because I am not sure I will get anything out of it as I am a no limit and pot limit player. Also, the level I play at is way below what the authors write about.

Is there any benefit, to a player like myself, picking up the book?
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  #3  
Old 11-10-2007, 09:44 AM
Niediam Niediam is offline
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Default Re: Winning in Tough Hold \'em Games

I consider WITHG to be the second best limit hold'em book ever written (behind SSH) and the gap between it and the third best is quite large.
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  #4  
Old 11-10-2007, 09:54 AM
1p0kerboy 1p0kerboy is offline
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Default Re: Winning in Tough Hold \'em Games

I'm primarily a no-limit player. But recently I've played a bit of fixed limit hold 'em. I bought the book, and what Mason says is true. It is outstanding and it definitely helped me find some leaks in my game. I highly recommend it.
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  #5  
Old 11-10-2007, 12:40 PM
smbruin22 smbruin22 is offline
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Default Re: Winning in Tough Hold \'em Games

i expect that it's a fantastic book. not too often that a world-class player lays things out like that.

but like the first respondant, i too have given up limit for NL forever (would go to omaha etc. if i ever got tired of NLHE).

will i be able to get alot out of it when i only play NL? i'm thinking yes. i think that it will teach alot about reading hands and about analyzing your play thru pokertracker....

so i think i will add it to my next order............ would have been so much better if author had done NL book. hopefully, he will
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  #6  
Old 11-10-2007, 01:27 PM
Troll_Inc Troll_Inc is offline
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Default Re: Winning in Tough Hold \'em Games

Why would anyone want to play in a tough game?
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  #7  
Old 11-10-2007, 01:42 PM
phydaux phydaux is offline
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Default Re: Winning in Tough Hold \'em Games

[ QUOTE ]
Why would anyone want to play in a tough game?

[/ QUOTE ]

It's a question of win rate.

Do you want to play 10/20 and make 3 bb/hr, or 40/80 and make 1 bb/hr?

You can make more money at the higher table, but you have to have the BR & skills. Of the two, the BR is the easy part.

Sorry Mason, but I also have given up limit for NL. I am not, however, foolish enough to belive that it is "forever."

Your old conjecture is still true - The fish go broke faster a NL than at limit. Modern capped buy-ins have slowed the money hemorage from a gush to a spurt, but eventually the suckers will bleed to death faster than they can be replaced with newbies.

At that time the pros will all have to take up limit poker again, because that's what the fish will all be playing.

Now what form of limit poker the fish will be playing is anyone's guess, but if it's limit hold'em then we'll all end up buying Stox's book.

Personally I think it will be HORSE or SHOE, in which case we'll have to buy the book anyway.
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  #8  
Old 11-10-2007, 02:10 PM
Gelford Gelford is offline
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Default Re: Winning in Tough Hold \'em Games

[ QUOTE ]

Your old conjecture is still true - The fish go broke faster a NL than at limit. Modern capped buy-ins have slowed the money hemorage from a gush to a spurt, but eventually the suckers will bleed to death faster than they can be replaced with newbies.


[/ QUOTE ]


Well ... perhaps in an old school casino world, where NL starts at 1/2$ ... but you're forgetting that you these days can play penny NL, nobody needs to go broke anymore unless they have a gambling problem.
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  #9  
Old 11-10-2007, 03:13 PM
Gonso Gonso is offline
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Default Re: Winning in Tough Hold \'em Games

I think what hurts it is that it might be a couple rungs too high on the ladder relative to most readers' LHE games (including mine). Plus, you know, it's limit.

At this point I've read enough books that new material is a little harder to come by than when I first started studying, but this book is filled with truly expert-level content. It's really going to take a few reads.

In time, though, I think this book will be better recognized for what it is.
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  #10  
Old 11-10-2007, 03:15 PM
MicroBob MicroBob is offline
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Default Re: Winning in Tough Hold \'em Games

Mason- I agree. This book is super-cool.

Glad to see you guys corrected the oversight and added it to the 'books' page so that people can actually order it.
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