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#201
11-22-2007, 05:22 PM
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Re: *Official Euro 2008 Qualifying Thread*
[ QUOTE ]
So you are really arguing that who ever the coach was, we wouldnt have qualified? That is nonsense. [/ QUOTE ] No, I'm saying the actual people who played the matches and not a man sitting in the technical box should bare more of the responsibility. 
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#202
11-22-2007, 05:39 PM
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Re: *Official Euro 2008 Qualifying Thread*
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] You realize these aren't the actual groups, these are the pots for the draw, right? [/ QUOTE ] Do you realize that he presented 4 teams that could end up in the same group, and not one of the seeding groups? [/ QUOTE ] I'm just saying it's silly to talk about the relative strengths of groups before they're actually selected.
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#203
11-22-2007, 05:48 PM
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Re: *Official Euro 2008 Qualifying Thread*
[ QUOTE ]
Enough about England, lets look at the teams that made it and their seedings for the draw on Dec. 2 in Vienna: Pot 1: Switzerland (hosts), Austria (hosts), Greece (holders), Netherlands Pot 2: Croatia, Italy, Czech Republic, Sweden Pot 3: Germany, Romania, Portugal, Spain Pot 4: Poland, France, Turkey, Russia Possibility of a real "group of death" with Netherlands, Italy, Germany and France all in the same round robin group. [/ QUOTE ] Can someone with more firsthand knowledge of Netherlands fill me in? I haven't watched any of their qualifiers, but they have really struggled to score. On paper they should be one of the favorites. Portugal are always a dangerous team with Ronaldo, Quaresma, Nani, Deco, etc, but they lack a top-class striker which I think will prevent them from making a deep run. Unless the Dutch can find a formation and play-style that suits them or unless the Portuguese somehow develop a striker in the next 6 months, then the cream of the crop has to be Italy, Germany, France and Spain. If they only had Nesta and Totti, Italy would be clear favorites, but even without those two they have depth and balance at every position. Totti has never played as stunningly with the Azzuri as he has in Rome and Nesta was injured during the World Cup. Germany don't seem to have as many world-class stars as other top European nations but their results in tournaments speak for themselves. In 2006 they shed their defensive image and played some of the most beautiful, attacking football at the World Cup. France are really loaded. I'm shocked that anyone would say they are overrated. They are well represented at the finest clubs in the world, Arsenal, Barcelona, Chelsea, Manchester United. In addition, they are brimming with young domestic talent such as Benzema and Ben Arfa who are becoming stars. Trezequet, a top striker in Serie A, has routinely been left of the roster. France took 4 points from Italy in qualification and were only ever in trouble due to two fluky results against inferior Scotland. Although Spain have such a history of ineptitude in major tournaments, this generation will be able to match every opponent in talent. Their style of play at the best of times can be a joy to show. At the worst of times they can dominate a match yet fail to produce a result. They have a world-class goalkeeper, Puyol anchors the defense, Xavi, Cesc, etc headline the midfield and they have plentiful riches up front with David Villa, Torres, etc. As is always the case, the Euro field is well balanced, and knockout tournaments produce high variance, but there is a good chance of the champion coming from one of the four above powerhouses.
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#204
11-22-2007, 05:50 PM
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Re: *Official Euro 2008 Qualifying Thread*
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] So you are really arguing that who ever the coach was, we wouldnt have qualified? That is nonsense. [/ QUOTE ] No, I'm saying the actual people who played the matches and not a man sitting in the technical box should bare more of the responsibility. [/ QUOTE ] No, it is the responsibility of the manager, in that the buck stops with him. Is it a coincidence that under Mclaren you had 7-8 players under performing on a routine basis? If one or two players are playing poorly on a regular basis then yes those players probably should shoulder some of the burden of the blame, but then the manager can allways drop them. However a good manager will know how to deal with and riase the form of the personal at his disposal. However if you have a whole team under performing on a regular basis, this can only be due to the manager. It is his job to take players who dont play together on a regular basis and meld them into a unit that believes in itself and raises its games. Though let us put this into context. This campaign hasnt just been poor, it has been a total and utter disaster. The last time England failed to qualify for an Euro cup was 20 years ago in 1988. We havnt just been poor or below par, we have been utterly abysmal. All Mclaren had won before taking over at England was the worthless cup. When he was installed many including myself predicted disaster and that is exactly what has happened.
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#205
11-22-2007, 06:03 PM
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Re: *Official Euro 2008 Qualifying Thread*
Here is the approximate chance that each team has to win Euro 2008. I used the odds from bodog and then made it so the percentages summed to 100%.
Italy 11.17% Germany 11.17% France 9.08% Spain 9.08% Netherlands 7.26% Portugal 7.26% Czech Republic 5.59% Croatia 4.84% Switzerland 3.82% Sweden 2.50% Greece 3.16% Russia 2.14% Romania 2.79% Turkey 2.50% Poland 1.77% Austria 1.08%
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#206
11-22-2007, 06:29 PM
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Re: *Official Euro 2008 Qualifying Thread*
[ QUOTE ]
they lack a top-class striker which I think will prevent them from making a deep run. [/ QUOTE ] [ QUOTE ] rumania, Portugal, Spain are all teams I'd concider to somewhat lack the mindset for a big tourney. [/ QUOTE ] Euro 2000: lost in the semi-finals Euro 2004: lost in the finals WC 2006: lost in the semi-finals Other than our horrible performance in 2002 we've been great in big tournaments. My obviously biased opinion is that we're clearly the best team in that pot.
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#208
11-22-2007, 09:16 PM
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Re: *Official Euro 2008 Qualifying Thread*
[ QUOTE ]
Euro 2000: lost in the semi-finals Euro 2004: lost in the finals WC 2006: lost in the semi-finals Other than our horrible performance in 2002 we've been great in big tournaments. My obviously biased opinion is that we're clearly the best team in that pot. [/ QUOTE ] In that same time frame Italy, France and Germany all put up (slightly) more impressive results. Portugal are a good team, they are probably between 7th-12th best in the world and have run a little hot the last few tournaments. Portugal have the 5th best odds to win the tournament. If wouldn't be a big shock if they did. I think everyone agrees they are a very strong team. Still, I'm sure you wish they had a better striker. France has at least four or five strikers (Henry, Anelka, Cisse, Trezequet, Benzema) that are better than Portugal's first choice. Since you think they are the best team in their pot, I'll give you 2 to 1 odds that Portugal don't finish better than Spain and Germany.
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#209
11-22-2007, 09:51 PM
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Re: *Official Euro 2008 Qualifying Thread*
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] Euro 2000: lost in the semi-finals Euro 2004: lost in the finals WC 2006: lost in the semi-finals Other than our horrible performance in 2002 we've been great in big tournaments. My obviously biased opinion is that we're clearly the best team in that pot. [/ QUOTE ] In that same time frame Italy, France and Germany all put up (slightly) more impressive results. Portugal are a good team, they are probably between 7th-12th best in the world and have run a little hot the last few tournaments. Portugal have the 5th best odds to win the tournament. If wouldn't be a big shock if they did. I think everyone agrees they are a very strong team. Still, I'm sure you wish they had a better striker. France has at least four or five strikers (Henry, Anelka, Cisse, Trezequet, Benzema) that are better than Portugal's first choice. Since you think they are the best team in their pot, I'll give you 2 to 1 odds that Portugal don't finish better than Spain and Germany. [/ QUOTE ] France and Italy were two of the top 3 teams in the world for the past ten years or so, saying they were better than portugal isn't really saying much [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img] Germany on the other hand wasn't (and isn't) no where near as good as any of the teams mentioned, imo. They are way overrated right now because of Germany's history and the fact that they did well in the previous WC. PS: that doesn't seem like a good bet for me, at all [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]
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