SSHE better for middle limits ?

[Machmood]

I have been playing for years, but just started reading on the subject. I have read SSHE and just began reading middle limit holdem bye ciafone, but finding SSHE much more relivant to the games i play in(mostly 20-40 sum 10-20) Middle limit seems like he advises very tight play, even one hand he gives a scenario of being on the button with AK, early limper, middle position raises, and he advises just calling. The 20/40 games i play in are the usuall loose/aggressive game, with usual multiway pots. Middle limit claims to teach game play for 15-30 to 50-100, but prob geared toward higher limits?

[BeakWetter]

I'm not sure what the question is, but I have read both and I also play between 10-20 and 20-40.

SSHE should be the first book you read on limit IMO.

Ciafone's book is a little dry writing style wise. I also find that he could get his point across with half of the pages he uses for his quiz questions. I too find myself opting for raises more than he does... and I don't think it has to do with 20-40 vs 50-100 (just read the posts here for few months). He does advocate mixing your game up when you have position. So just calling with AK may be along that line of thought.
The quizzes are good to get you thinking in middle limit mood, but overall gain from the book lacks in comparison to others out there.

[MitchL]

SSHE is decent for live middle limit games of today, but recognize that trends and game conditions are always changing so I rarely find it necessary to read a book when these forums are available. Not only do they provide relevant advice for current live mlhe game conditions they offer a form of debate on tougher topics, which books do not.

[Machmood]

i agree, but i have played in 20-40 games at borgata and foxwoods(and the 15-30 at bellagio) and am shocked to see how loose these games are, and how willing people are to throw their money away. It just seems that higher stakes are playing more and more like the "small stakes" games SSHE talks about.

[bellatrix]

I believe that slowly but surely, 20/40 is becoming "small stakes", especially in card rooms where there are higher limits available. Ciaffone's book is also becoming a bit old, games have become a tad LAGer. He also warns that there is a more loose aggressive way to play some hands, but that that playing style is hard to teach.

There are some differences in the games to which SSHE is geared. At low limits, the games are so loose passive that it is correct to call any PP, many suited connectors and so on. It is also often correct to call on a gutshot (if you have the odds). At higher limits you'll be raised so often after you, that often you find yourself paying two bets on that low PP, suited connector or gutshot draw. So drawing hands lose value PreFlop, which automatically makes you tighter.

Many more differences, but both are excellent books, if you can capitalize on their best part IMO:
SSHE -> flop texture
MLHE -> hand analysis (I don't mind repetitiveness to get the point across)

[Fnord]

It's not about stakes, it's about texture.

SSHE: Regular 4+ way pots against mostly loose opponents
Tough HE Games: 2-3 way pots against loose ranges and mostly aggressive opponents
HEFAP (and most other material): 2-3 way pots against fairly tight ranges

[BigSlick75093]

I'll chime in with my two cents here:
I would read the following, pretty much in this order, although 2 & 3 could go either way:
1) SSHE (Mandatory reading)
2) Limit hold'em for Advanced players (Sklansky)
3) Theory of Poker (Sklansky)
4) Winning in Tough Hold'em

I admit, I have not read Ciafone's book (I can never find it at my bookstore)

Regarding the Tough Hold'em Games, I don't play high limits (Mainly 2/4 and 3/6), but I still feel this book is invaluable even for these games in regards to stealing blinds, defending blinds, and different betting lines to use. I have definitely improved my game by reading that.

Thus, I use all 4 of these books in my play. IMO, they are all useful. But SSHE is absolutely mandatory reading, imo.

[surfdoc]

You need to read them both and apply them both for certain types of games. The middle limit book would better be titled "folding hold em for advanced players" since the advice is generally too weak. That being said I think there is a lot to be learned in there with respect to tough folds. If I could only read one it would be SSHE but unless you are forced into that option you should read both.

BTW, not 3 betting the AK there is going to be pretty wrong in almost any game.

[emerson]

[ QUOTE ]
You need to read them both and apply them both for certain types of games. The middle limit book would better be titled "folding hold em for advanced players" since the advice is generally too weak. That being said I think there is a lot to be learned in there with respect to tough folds. If I could only read one it would be SSHE but unless you are forced into that option you should read both.

BTW, not 3 betting the AK there is going to be pretty wrong in almost any game.

[/ QUOTE ]

Yes. Read the Malmuth review of this book in the back of Gambling Theory and Other Topics... spot on.