Two Plus Two Newer Archives  

Go Back   Two Plus Two Newer Archives > PL/NL Texas Hold'em > Small Stakes

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old 06-25-2007, 02:30 PM
Ben86 Ben86 is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Homesick for non-existent place
Posts: 650
Default 200NL I try to get value and he minraises me.

Villian is a 35/12/1.4. What line would have worked better? I thought i was getting value but apparently not

Full Tilt No-Limit Hold'em, $2 BB (6 handed) Hand History Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com (Format: 2+2 Forums)

UTG ($391.50)
MP ($428.30)
CO ($417.25)
Button ($110.40)
Hero ($222)
BB ($200)

Preflop: Hero is SB with Q[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], A[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img].
<font color="#666666">2 folds</font>, <font color="#CC3333">CO raises to $7</font>, <font color="#666666">1 fold</font>, Hero calls $6, <font color="#666666">1 fold</font>.

Flop: ($16) 6[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], Q[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], 5[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
Hero checks, <font color="#CC3333">CO bets $12</font>, Hero calls $12.

Turn: ($40) 5[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
<font color="#CC3333">Hero bets $35</font>, <font color="#CC3333">CO raises to $70</font>, Hero calls $35.

River: ($180) K[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
Hero checks, <font color="#CC3333">CO bets $144</font>
Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old 06-25-2007, 02:34 PM
joeblack joeblack is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: lol.. wait, what?
Posts: 1,672
Default Re: 200NL I try to get value and he minraises me.

I 3-bet this PF against a 35/12/1.4

As played on the flop, you should have c/r the flop to $40.

As played on the turn, standard, with that raise you are most likely beat.

River easy fold.

(wow... you botched this hand)
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 06-25-2007, 02:36 PM
dirtylobster dirtylobster is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Posts: 2,124
Default Re: 200NL I try to get value and he minraises me.

I'd either lead or checkraise flop depending on my image and how the table's been running. Check/calling the flop sucks as you don't get any information about villains hand. The turn minraise gives you a hint and the river is obviously a clear check/fold.

I'd also 3-bet preflop most of the time.
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 06-25-2007, 02:38 PM
ReptileHouse ReptileHouse is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 2005
Posts: 1,203
Default Re: 200NL I try to get value and he minraises me.

I fold to the turn raise, personally. On this board, I don't mind your flop/turn line, although I'd have 3-bet it pre-flop against this guy. If it were a bit drier, I would c/c turn and bet river 1/2 pot for value if turn is checked through, check folding river if he bet turn.

As played, fold river.
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 06-25-2007, 02:43 PM
Ben86 Ben86 is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Homesick for non-existent place
Posts: 650
Default Re: 200NL I try to get value and he minraises me.

Why do you all love check raising flop so much more than calling and leading the turn?
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 06-25-2007, 02:51 PM
Poker_is_Hard Poker_is_Hard is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Bluffing into the Nuts
Posts: 661
Default Re: 200NL I try to get value and he minraises me.

[ QUOTE ]
Why do you all love check raising flop so much more than calling and leading the turn?

[/ QUOTE ]

What is the advantage of check/calling and then leading?

Check raising exposes the strength of your hand and therefore allows you to get a read on his hand base on his reaction.

When you C/C and then lead, you have allowed the hand to move to the turn and you still have no idea where you stand. So when you lead bet gets raised you are now sitting with your thumb up your butt.. are you ahead, behind, does he had AQ too?... you have no idea and no cheap way of finding out.
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 06-25-2007, 03:00 PM
Ben86 Ben86 is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Homesick for non-existent place
Posts: 650
Default Re: 200NL I try to get value and he minraises me.

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Why do you all love check raising flop so much more than calling and leading the turn?

[/ QUOTE ]

What is the advantage of check/calling and then leading?

Check raising exposes the strength of your hand and therefore allows you to get a read on his hand base on his reaction.

When you C/C and then lead, you have allowed the hand to move to the turn and you still have no idea where you stand. So when you lead bet gets raised you are now sitting with your thumb up your butt.. are you ahead, behind, does he had AQ too?... you have no idea and no cheap way of finding out.

[/ QUOTE ]


if I Cr and am called i got the same information as leading for the same price except on a later street.. i think chk call and lead is good as well unless im missing something.
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 06-25-2007, 03:05 PM
ReptileHouse ReptileHouse is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 2005
Posts: 1,203
Default Re: 200NL I try to get value and he minraises me.

[ QUOTE ]
Check raising exposes the strength of your hand and therefore allows you to get a read on his hand base on his reaction.

[/ QUOTE ]

So you're raising for information? Ugh. Really. Ugh. If you raise, it should either be as a bluff to get better hands to fold (no way he folds AA or KK here to a flop raise), or to get value from worse hands (unlikely he calls a flop raise with pairs less than a queen).

If you raise this flop, you're folding out worse hands and getting called by better ones. You're also bloating the pot out of position with two streets of betting to go when you have a solid hand you'd like to show down in a medium size pot. Not good.

[ QUOTE ]
When you C/C and then lead, you have allowed the hand to move to the turn and you still have no idea where you stand.

[/ QUOTE ]

Nonsense. Put villain on a range of hands. Play poker. When you lead turn, you're going to get called a fair amount by worse hands thinking you're just messing with them as well as sometimes by a draw when villain raised with a suited connector or suited ace. Better hands will sometimes call, sometimes raise. Worse hands will almost never raise unless villain is absolutely blufftastic. That's a much better situation, on a later street, for the same price as raising the flop.
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old 06-25-2007, 03:07 PM
joeblack joeblack is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: lol.. wait, what?
Posts: 1,672
Default Re: 200NL I try to get value and he minraises me.

Ben86: Why do you want to be a passive player?

I recommend the c/r on the flop to build the pot and put pressure on the bettor by showing the strength in our hand and getting a reaction on his hand. Continue with a bet on the turn etc..

By c/c and leading the turn... we don't have any idea on what kind of hand the villian has. On the flop Q65 (two diamonds), if he calls the c/r we can put him on a Q, 78 draw, diamonds. etc.

Raise em up!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

p.s. I disagree with reptiles post above^^^
Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old 06-25-2007, 03:07 PM
Vegas_VIP Vegas_VIP is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Buffalo
Posts: 286
Default Re: 200NL I try to get value and he minraises me.

;p;
Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 02:27 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions Inc.