Two Plus Two Newer Archives  

Go Back   Two Plus Two Newer Archives > PL/NL Texas Hold'em > Medium Stakes

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old 10-04-2006, 03:54 PM
mak15 mak15 is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: u penn
Posts: 2,093
Default Nl600 i\'m weak with KK

villain is zero2lose. he's 21/17/4 over a lot of hands. i think my read of him is a pretty standard unremarkable multi tabler. my image should be sLAG, he know's me well enough to probably think i can do some weird stuff, including 3betting wide, but i havn't done anything weird during this session. i always bet the river here but didn't this time. i'll explain my logic after i get a few responses. i was talking poker with another 2+2er during the hand so i thought about it more than normal, and maybe overthought myself. also, if i bet the river, 300 fold to a raise?

Party Poker No-Limit Hold'em, $ BB (6 handed) Hand History Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com (Format: 2+2 Forums)

Hero ($1023.17)
Button ($214.75)
SB ($1796.11)
BB ($235)
UTG ($1249.60)
MP ($143.65)

Preflop: Hero is CO with K[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], K[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]. SB posts a blind of $3.
<font color="#CC3333">UTG raises to $21</font>, <font color="#666666">1 fold</font>, <font color="#CC3333">Hero raises to $70</font>, <font color="#666666">2 folds</font>, BB calls $64, UTG calls $49.

Flop: ($213) 7[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], J[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], 4[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(3 players)</font>
BB checks, <font color="#CC3333">UTG bets $130</font>, Hero calls $130, BB folds.

Turn: ($473) 9[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
UTG checks, Hero checks.

River: ($473) 4[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
UTG checks, Hero checks.
Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old 10-04-2006, 04:01 PM
Requin Requin is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Back online
Posts: 6,446
Default Re: Nl600 i\'m weak with KK

I don't think his flop lead makes any sense at all for a big hand, its a perfect spot to CR a set. Anyways, I would bet the river for value, and obv. fold to a raise.
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 10-04-2006, 04:08 PM
yvesaint yvesaint is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 2005
Posts: 12,779
Default Re: Nl600 i\'m weak with KK

if ur gonna check turn u gotta bet this river imo....

also depends on BB
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 10-04-2006, 04:10 PM
mak15 mak15 is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: u penn
Posts: 2,093
Default Re: Nl600 i\'m weak with KK

[ QUOTE ]
if ur gonna check turn u gotta bet this river imo....

also depends on BB

[/ QUOTE ]

if we bet turn is with the intention of calling a raise?

bb just sat down and sat short.
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 10-04-2006, 04:10 PM
Leptyne Leptyne is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: in the cut
Posts: 1,219
Default Re: Nl600 i\'m weak with KK

Generally I don't like playing for stacks with an overpair. When he leads the flop into your 3-bet, even though the bet size is weak he is indicating strengh. If you bet the turn you're facing the probable checkraise. If you bet the river what hands that you beat do you expect to call here. About all I see is QQ. I don't like betting the river when a push makes you puke.
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 10-04-2006, 04:11 PM
Requin Requin is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Back online
Posts: 6,446
Default Re: Nl600 i\'m weak with KK

You can get called by JcXc on the river as well as QQ.
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 10-04-2006, 04:24 PM
Superfluous Man Superfluous Man is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Same rake, better progress
Posts: 3,130
Default Re: Nl600 i\'m weak with KK

After you check behind on the turn, you gotta take him to value town on the river.
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 10-04-2006, 04:30 PM
mak15 mak15 is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: u penn
Posts: 2,093
Default Re: Nl600 i\'m weak with KK

here's my thinking on the checking the river summed up real quick:

i pretty much never call this flop with just two overs unless i have the flush draw, it's just too likely he has a set and we can't really expect the shortstack to go away, so floating makes no sense to me. so villain should know i have QQ+ a very high percentage of the time. this being the case it makes a ton of sense for him to go for the check/raise on the turn and then when i check i have to bet my QQ+ on the river right? so c/r again. If he has TT he shouldn't be putting any more money in the pot after i call the flop i'd think?

i think in this hand i'm giving too much credit to an average opponent who will probably never c/r bluff here and may well pay off with TT, Jx, and especially QQ.

but i do kind of think against a good, tricky player, checking behind makes a lot of sense with the other option being betting with the intention of calling a shove.
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old 10-04-2006, 04:42 PM
mayday4379 mayday4379 is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Posts: 946
Default Re: Nl600 i\'m weak with KK

i think my read of him is a pretty standard unremarkable multi tabler.

I think the time you're C/R on the river isn't often enough to make up for the value you lose by betting either the turn or river.

If i'm villain and I have a J or club draw, then I smile to myself when we go to SD, because I just got off cheap playing weak cards OOP.

Most players will bet the river if they missed their C/R on the turn. Based on your read, I bet the river.
Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old 10-04-2006, 04:48 PM
Requin Requin is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Back online
Posts: 6,446
Default Re: Nl600 i\'m weak with KK

Your reasoning makes more sense to me on a dry board, you can certainly have a busted draw in this spot.
Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 07:41 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions Inc.