QQ 3 bet pot deep

Profish2285 · #1 11-19-2007, 10:58 PM

Button runs at 28/22/8. MP runs at 24/18/6. Who here is just mucking pf? I felt that was a little weak at first but this whole hand is pretty difficult to play. As played, what are you doing on the flop and why?

Full Tilt No-Limit Hold'em, $0.50 BB (6 handed) Full Tilt Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com (Format: 2+2 Forums)

saw flop|saw showdown

UTG ($19.25)
MP ($66.25)
CO ($44.10)
Button ($80.05)
Hero ($143.10)
BB ($56.10)

Preflop: Hero is SB with Q[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], Q[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img].
UTG calls $0.50, MP raises to $2.25, 1 fold, Button raises to $8, Hero calls $7.75, 1 fold, UTG folds, MP calls $5.75.

Flop: ($25) 6[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], 2[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], 5[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (3 players)
Hero checks, MP checks, Button bets $18, Hero....

JoshNjuice · #2 11-19-2007, 11:14 PM

Any idea what BU's r/r range is here? At 28/22, he's probably re-raising light here enough to play QQ ("light" includes AQs, 88+).

As played, your SPR is ~3 and I like that flop. MP was calling PF with a wide range because there was so much in the pot. BU and MP3 both have a wide enough PFR range that you're not terrified of AA/KK here.

Shove and hope you get called by 88-JJ.

whyzze · #3 11-19-2007, 11:18 PM

you realize your overcall is just as transparent as a 4bet to a decent player and it also provides MP odds to setmine, while losing value the times you are ahead of button....which is like always.

call...if mp shoves you can fold.

not totally sure about the call plan, but i think its got the best EV considering their ranges.

Profish2285 · #4 11-19-2007, 11:34 PM

Whyzze so youre 4 betting here Im guessing? I just hate 4 betting QQ pf but I guess this is a spot for it. As far as calling flop, what are you doing on a blank turn? How about an A or K turn?

matrix · #5 11-19-2007, 11:36 PM

raise preflop for value. You are so far ahead of buttons 3bet range it's not funny and we don't want this to go three ways.

check/shove flop - what kind of flop are you hoping for exactly flat calling a 3bet from an overaggro button 3bettor whose range is huge?

If we call we have less than a PSB behind - and what's the plan if paint turns up??

If anyone here has AA/KK it's MP - and if he stacks us we still cover overaggro button who we have position on.

I think calling here opens up a can of worms the few times a non Q broadway card hits.

vixticator · #6 11-19-2007, 11:37 PM

Calling, raising or folding are all fine pf imo. If UTG were to fold MP shove and Button fold, you call (if overcall). As played c/f flop is fine. Anyone can make a case for bet/fold or are we always being shoved after a lead? Is Button capable of light 3bets? If yes, re-raise preflop is fine as well. MP's range should be wide. Button idk need more info, I'd assume JJ+, AK without more reads.

matrix · #7 11-19-2007, 11:43 PM

[ QUOTE ]
Is Button capable of light 3bets?

[/ QUOTE ]

you don't get to have 28/20 vpip/pfr stats without 3betting "light"

I 3bet light and limit my light 3bets to LP openers who have highish Attempt to steal %'s and after 18kish hands my stats are 20/15 or so...

vixticator · #8 11-19-2007, 11:50 PM

[ QUOTE ]
you don't get to have 28/20 vpip/pfr stats without 3betting "light"

I 3bet light and limit my light 3bets to LP openers who have highish Attempt to steal %'s and after 18kish hands my stats are 20/15 or so...

[/ QUOTE ]Good point. I agree with you now, 4bet. Also, I'd switch tables unless other opponents were huge donks. [img]/images/graemlins/tongue.gif[/img]

pokerplaya5 · #9 11-19-2007, 11:51 PM

I would definitely 4 bet preflop. As played, I still call flop bet and if blank on turn, I push.

Profish2285 · #10 11-19-2007, 11:52 PM

They were pretty bad as I got my stack somehow. This may be an obvious question but I will ask it anyway. Assuming I 4 bet pf to like 25 or so, I am calling a shove right?