600: I Know We All Hate It But..

[QTip]

Here are two hands I played yesterday, where I felt I needed to lay a set down. We all hate the idea of laying down a set when you're playing 100x...but what do you think of these? Both of the villains in these hands are very good regs.

Poker Stars, $3/$6 NL Hold'em Cash Game, 8 Players
LegoPoker Hand History Converter

UTG: $1,172.55
UTG+1: $600
MP1: $210
MP2: $1,029.25
CO: $706.40
Hero (BTN): $576
SB: $615.45
BB: $600

Pre-Flop: 3[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 3[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] dealt to Hero (BTN)
3 folds, MP2 calls $6, CO folds, Hero calls $6, SB calls $3, BB checks

Flop: ($24) T[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 3[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] 4[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (4 Players)
SB checks, BB checks, <font color="red">MP2 bets $18</font>, <font color="red">Hero raises to $50</font>, SB folds, <font color="red">BB raises to $150</font>


Poker Stars, $2/$4 NL Hold'em Cash Game, 8 Players
LegoPoker Hand History Converter

BB: $441.20
UTG: $74
UTG+1: $351.70
Hero (MP1): $423.45
MP2: $694.05
CO: $471.55
BTN: $400
SB: $77

Pre-Flop: 3[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] 3[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] dealt to Hero (MP1)
2 folds, Hero calls $4, MP2 folds, CO calls $4, <font color="red">BTN raises to $20</font>, SB folds, BB calls $16, Hero calls $16, CO calls $16

Flop: ($82) 3[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] T[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 6[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (4 Players)
BB checks, Hero checks, CO checks, BTN checks

Turn: ($82) 4[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (4 Players)
BB checks, <font color="red">Hero bets $65</font>, 2 folds, <font color="red">BB raises to $160</font>

[PLAYOFFS]

I don't think you can fold hand 1, for the possibility of the flush draw. Villain could have 5h6h or other hands or any 2pair hands (he was in the BB).

The Second hand is difficult because you didn't bet the flop. Giving that turn card can definitely reduce the value of your set given the possible gutshot draw or 444. I hate laying down sets ever. But imo, it would be much easier to lay down hand #2 than hand #1.

[iponnet]

some stats on villans? my 22/33 are losers for me, hwo about you? whenever I hit a set I think I cant/shouldnt lay them down especially in limped pots when you are playing for stacks there is a good chance someone has you beat so I think this might be a leak, but srsly who can lay a set down on either of these boards?!!!

I am starting to think playing them especially from EP is a leak and they should only be played vs specific opponents!

[RiverMustelid]

Im not folding hand one with str8 and flush draws out there. If you do, there is just no point ever limping your little pairs &lt; 66, as you aren't prepared to felt if someone gets aggressive against you and you hold bottom set.

The 2nd one I could probably find a fold depending on the villain. I really hate hthese unraised set hands, although I do sometimes limp them myself.

[Split Suit]

i can certainly find a fold in Hand 1 given his line. i dont see that CR over a bet/raise being anything less than 56hh (and i dont see it being that often cuz its not like hes waiting for the preflop aggressor to CB). i can lay this one down and not feel bad about it

Hand 2...rly have to donk the flop. PF aggressor isnt CBing lite into 3 other ppl, and u cant account on his CB too often (also good, cuz when BTN does have a hand, he has to raise his big hands, which allows us to work our stacks in). id much rather donk here. as played...i have no idea what to do on the turn (because flop line, ldo). i probably call cuz ima station, and call river bets on most cards

[QTip]

I stacked on both and lots to oversets and mumbled to myself how I suck.

[iponnet]

[ QUOTE ]
i can certainly find a fold in Hand 1 given his line. i dont see that CR over a bet/raise being anything less than 56hh (and i dont see it being that often cuz its not like hes waiting for the preflop aggressor to CB). i can lay this one down and not feel bad about it

Hand 2...rly have to donk the flop. PF aggressor isnt CBing lite into 3 other ppl, and u cant account on his CB too often (also good, cuz when BTN does have a hand, he has to raise his big hands, which allows us to work our stacks in). id much rather donk here. as played...i have no idea what to do on the turn (because flop line, ldo). i probably call cuz ima station, and call river bets on most cards

[/ QUOTE ]

wth you talking about!!!! try not giving too much advice around here, we stack off way more on hand 1 than hand 2

[Split Suit]

wrong. anyone that can read a line for anything understands what i just said.

(unless ur strictly goin by the "dont go broke in a limped pot" rule)

[guaranteedBluff]

i'd go broke on both

[Proofrock]

Hand 1 is a bad candidate to lay down a set, IMO. Since it's a limped pot TT is much less likely, and BB could just as easily have 6h5h, T4,43,Ah5h,Ah2h,5h2h,etc. Too many combo draws and other 2-pair draws out there to consider folding a set, especially since TT has to be somewhat discounted.

Hand 2 is closer, but I think if you're behind you at least have outs -- you can go either way, but I go with calling because people show up with unexpected stuff all the time.