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  #1  
Old 09-19-2007, 08:21 PM
pokerchap pokerchap is offline
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Default the purpose of optimism

hey everyone,

I read and post a lot and really love the psychology forum because the ppl arent dicks like most other forums and there is some good stuff in here that isnt only poker related

anyways, I am a HUGE pessimist because I dont understand the point of being optimistic, especially in poker. I dont understand how saying " im gonna win this tourney" really helps you win. Whether im optimistic of pessimistic it doesn't affect my play. I know a lot of ppl will say " you think its not but it is" this is not the case. In sports too. I really dont understand how thinking in my mind that i am gonna lose to a certain team affects the outcome. I still play hard and do my best.

I just dont understand how being optimistic changes things.
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  #2  
Old 09-19-2007, 09:00 PM
recallme recallme is offline
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Default Re: the purpose of optimism

It changes how you perceive things that happen.
If you didn`t get one set in you past 1k hands an
optimist says: I haven`t got it so long it will come during the next few hands and that`s it.

pessimist says: i am running so bad lately, never hit a [censored] hand. A result could be a stupid bluff.

Pehaps this isn`t the best example.

I think the big diffeence is how you play.
If you ae a pessimist you could be getting too weak-tight
being optimistic could make you a cs or "maniac"
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  #3  
Old 09-19-2007, 09:20 PM
pokerchap pokerchap is offline
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Default Re: the purpose of optimism

I understand the difference but I dont understand how it helps you in sports/poker. I know it makes you generally a happier person if your optimistic but If it doesn't take you off your A game by being pessimistic.... it shouldn't really have an impact but ppl still claim it does.
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Old 09-19-2007, 09:27 PM
Peleus Peleus is offline
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Default Re: the purpose of optimism

Its not so much being optimistic / pessimistic that matters, but rather how you let it effect you.

Generally speaking if you're one or the other, but can play calmly and rationally either way, it will make no difference.

If you really let it get to you, and you're optimistic you will generally be in a better happy frame of mind to play, and make decision correctly. If you're pessimistic and you let it get it too you, I imagine you would be more prone to tilt and making bad calls, etc, because your head is in the wrong place.
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  #5  
Old 09-19-2007, 09:43 PM
aaokwitme aaokwitme is offline
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Default Re: the purpose of optimism

being optimistic can help you keep a good poker mind set

http://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/showth...ue#Post11047003
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  #6  
Old 09-19-2007, 10:04 PM
garcia1000 garcia1000 is offline
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Default Re: the purpose of optimism

It may not affect your play, but your mindset will affect the play of your opponents.
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  #7  
Old 09-21-2007, 01:44 AM
reddred reddred is offline
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Default Re: the purpose of optimism

Thats very pessimistic of you to see no purpose in optimism....

Seriously, tho, there has been a lot written about the power of positive thinking....whether it's with success in business, sports (ever heard in golf to visualize the shot u want before hitting the ball) and even studies done( sorry, to lazy to look up links) about the power of positive thinking in regards to speading up the healing process for those recovering from injuries/illness.

Now, since all this falls into the category of scientifically unprovable, it really comes down to whether you "believe" or not in these abstract things(which you obv. dont).

I think the long and short of it is that it probably works for those who believe and put energy into it, and probably doesn't for those who think it's rubbish....
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  #8  
Old 09-21-2007, 02:18 AM
BigBuffet BigBuffet is offline
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Default Re: the purpose of optimism

I think the best mindset is in the middle. I call it “Middlemism”. But, it’s been discussed by many as not being results oriented--just playing each hand as best we are able.

In a related topic, I have this notion of the Right Amount of Effort. And it exists as a tightrope.

Slackers don’t try enough. Lombadi-ites try too hard. You see the latter more often. Try too hard (desperate) to get a date, job, winning poker session, etc. In life trying to hard often repels the result we want. The correct solution is to walk the tightrope between the two extremes.

Putting together Middle-mism and The Right-Amount-of-Effort-Tightrope, you will have a mindset that wants to win, but doesn’t try to hard or too little.

My best poker sessions occur when the poker is becomes seemingly secondary. When I am BS’ing with the other players I my mind is relaxed. Suckouts by Villains are no big deal. I make better reads. Players aren’t out to get me as much because I am one of them instead of the couple of players at the table that are quiet and serious.

It’s basic Caro and Negreanu. Just play and have fun, yet play well. The money will follow.
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  #9  
Old 10-01-2007, 01:41 AM
Kiten Kiten is offline
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Default Re: the purpose of optimism

Excuse my stating the "OBVIOUS", however, unbeknownst to the poster of this thread, simply continuing to play implies optimism/ a positive attitude about coming out of the game a winner--or at least improving their present financial position. Being NON-Sane/insane or perhaps continuing to play as a way of avoiding some other situation could also explain the continuance of play without optimism about the obtainable results.

Here's another example, I get in my car, crank it up and point it in the direction of the local Magic Mart. If I were not optimistic about actually getting to the Magic Mart, why get into my car in the first place, that is, of course, unless the act of getting into my car and attempting to go to the Magic Mart is simply an excuse to get out of the house, and in which case, I might just be wanting to be somewhere else. This however, also would imply some optimism being used, because, if we weren't optimistic about the car both cranking up and performing in a mechanically acceptable manner, we would instead be looking for a bike to ride or calling a cab.

So, without long term optimism, we normally would not engage in any activity. This is in contrast to the "Dale Carnigee" stare in the mirror, smile, and say "great" over and over again, approach to optimism.

Having said all this, the option of INSANITY is both viable and often the solid motivator and driving force behind many human actions. For example, it is a well known fact among many experienced gamblers, that many people gamble to Lose--not to win--and for these people, losing money in the casino or at the poker tables is seen as a clensing experience.

As to the general role of positive and negative thought, the optimist says, let's go to the moon, and the pessimist says "HOW EXACTLY" do you propose we do that--step by step?
Thus the steps of "engineering a successful project completion" are laid out, and the inherant problems of optimistic goals solved. So optimism suggests "WHAT", and pessimism details the "HOW" each step both can and cannot be accomplished. The two are inseparable in the "rational" doing of anything.

Benjamine
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  #10  
Old 10-02-2007, 12:00 AM
tarheeljks tarheeljks is offline
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Default Re: the purpose of optimism

[ QUOTE ]
Excuse my stating the "OBVIOUS", however, unbeknownst to the poster of this thread, simply continuing to play implies optimism/ a positive attitude about coming out of the game a winner--

[/ QUOTE ]

a lot of "optimism" about getting better/playing better is really egotism/denial.
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