Fire Mike Holmgren

[legend42]

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I am saying, that after their first four seasons at the helm, they both had IDENTICAL team records.

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Might have been wise to clarify that in your OP. And it would have a lot more validity if it were 2003, instead of four consecutive winning seasons and a Super Bowl appearance later.

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Holmgren did plenty of good in the past, but he has LOST it. (See George Siefert in Carolina, after being the coach with the NFL's all-time best coaching percentage)

Please read and respond to this, k/thx/bye

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You might be right about Holmgren, but your Erickson comparison is nonsensical.

[bernie]

It still doesn't show him not being a top 5 QB. After Manning and Brady, there's a cluster. Take the stat out of the vaccuum and put the other 3-7 top QBs stats up there and compare the average over the same years.

According to that, he was top 5 two years out of 5.(not counting this year). Where's the comparison with these other QBs? It's easy to throw out a stat but then not compare it with anyone else.

At least substantiate it with some comparative value.

b

[Dudd]

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After Manning and Brady, there's a cluster.

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I'd throw Palmer in there as well, but that's besides the point. Clearly, if there is a cluster for the final 2 or 3 spots, he isn't an easy top 5 quarterback, he's an easy top 10 quarterback.

[PokerFink]

Um, guys, I think we owe bernie an appology.

AVERAGE DPAR 2002 - 2007
1. Manning, 120
2. Brady, 75
3. Palmer, 68
4. Green, 66
5. Hasselbeck, 58
6. Bulger, 54
7. Favre, 51
8. Roethlisberger, 49
9. McNabb, 45
10. Pennington, 45
EDIT: 11. Gannon, 44
12. McNair, 43
13. Brees, 42


TOTAL DPAR 2002 - 2007
1. Manning, 721
2. Brady, 449
3. Green, 393
4. Hasselbeck, 350
5. Bulger, 322
6. Favre, 303
7. Palmer, 273
8. McNabb, 271
9. Pennington, 268
10. McNair, 258
11. Brees, 253
12. Culpepper, 195

[Kneel B4 Zod]

if you think Hasselbeck is currently better than Brees and Bulger (non broken rib version), ok.

[tarheeljks]

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if you think Hasselbeck is currently better than Brees and Bulger (non broken rib version), ok.

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true, but bulger's injury is the only reason he's ahead of him here. i just think brees is better.

edit: granted i did not expect trent green to be that high, even though he is underrated.

[liquidboss]

The real problem I see with Hasslebeck is that he gets flustered easy. John and Al were talking about it on Sunday night. At the beginning of his career with the Hawks we saw it all the time, making bad decisions, throwing the ball up for grabs, getting upset at himself and the situation. It looked like he was over it the last few years, but after seeing some of the mistakes he's made this season I'm starting to wonder if he just looked better because he wasn't facing advsersity. Now that things aren't going well with the running game and he's been playing from behind he's starting to look like old Matt again. That int in the 4th quarter is a perfect example of Matt 3+ years ago.

[adios]

I actually like Hasselbeck and have a soft spot for Holgrem (even given the ego maniac that he is) since I'm a Packer fan. Let's face it though, the trade for Branch hasn't worked at all. He's not putting up the numbers they expected from him. The front office screwed up with Huthcinson as bernie pointed out. I guess the signings of Wistrum and Peterson have been ok but not something that has made their defense all that good. Alexander had a couple of great seasons but maybe he's one of those running backs that doesn't have longevity I guess we'll see. Season's far from over but I'd put more blame for the current situation on the front office than Holmgren. Seattle's a little lacking in the talent department IMO.

Edit: Forgot about the Burleson signing. Not sure how much that was but given his production, probably too much money too.

Seattle seemed to have the idea that signing a few free agents would put them over the top in regards to winning the Super Bowl. I can understand that thinking but it's time to face the fact that the free agent signings haven't worked out and letting a free agent get away was a major booboo. Ask Adrian Peterson how he likes playing with Hutchinson [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img].

[bernie]

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Let's face it though, the trade for Branch hasn't worked at all.

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Branch was easiily worth a 1st round pick.

Holding on to D-Jack and K-Robinson too long was worse.

b

[Kneel B4 Zod]

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Branch was easiily worth a 1st round pick.

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Randy Moss fetched a 4th rounder, Wes Welker a 2nd rounder. neither of them are being paid Deion Branch money. They are both arguably better/more valuable than Deion. Welker and Branch are close I think.

it's transactions like that they have allowed the Pats to stay on top - getting cheaper AND better while gaining draft picks. Deion Branch for 1st rounder + big money against the cap is at best dubious for the Seahawks.