What are the top 10 starting hands in holdem?

[TyFuji]

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Also, the advantage of "suitedness" is somewhat less quantifiable when you consider the playability of suited cards. 2-card flushes are almost always going to be the best hand, with considerable implied odds from strong non-nut hands. So that 5% difference in pot equity conceals the implied profit: If I had to go heads up against a range like AA-JJ, I would pay twice or three times as much preflop with 87s than I would with 87o, significantly more than the 5% difference when you talk about face-up all in equity.

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Please, PLEASE, PLLLLLEASE let me know where you play!! I want in that game in a BAD WAY!!

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So you just play by absolute showdown equity? You don't think implied odds are an important part of NL (or LHE, for that matter)?

[JABoyd]

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Also, the advantage of "suitedness" is somewhat less quantifiable when you consider the playability of suited cards. 2-card flushes are almost always going to be the best hand, with considerable implied odds from strong non-nut hands. So that 5% difference in pot equity conceals the implied profit: If I had to go heads up against a range like AA-JJ, I would pay twice or three times as much preflop with 87s than I would with 87o, significantly more than the 5% difference when you talk about face-up all in equity.

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Please, PLEASE, PLLLLLEASE let me know where you play!! I want in that game in a BAD WAY!!

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So you just play by absolute showdown equity? You don't think implied odds are an important part of NL (or LHE, for that matter)?

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I absolutly consider implied odds. But implied odds post flop are a completely different story than implied odds preflop. Therefore, I don't over value suited cards preflop. I would go out of my way to play with someone who over values the implied odds of playing 2 suited cards preflop! So will you please invite me to your game? I'm asking nicely!

[Jimbo]

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Also, the advantage of "suitedness" is somewhat less quantifiable when you consider the playability of suited cards. 2-card flushes are almost always going to be the best hand, with considerable implied odds from strong non-nut hands. So that 5% difference in pot equity conceals the implied profit: If I had to go heads up against a range like AA-JJ, I would pay twice or three times as much preflop with 87s than I would with 87o, significantly more than the 5% difference when you talk about face-up all in equity.

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Please, PLEASE, PLLLLLEASE let me know where you play!! I want in that game in a BAD WAY!!

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So you just play by absolute showdown equity? You don't think implied odds are an important part of NL (or LHE, for that matter)?

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I absolutly consider implied odds. But implied odds post flop are a completely different story than implied odds preflop. Therefore, I don't over value suited cards preflop. I would go out of my way to play with someone who over values the implied odds of playing 2 suited cards preflop! So will you please invite me to your game? I'm asking nicely!

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If you don't play suited connectors more often than unsuited connectors you won't be able to afford the gas needed to drive to his game.

I didn't see where he stated that he overvalued suited cards, just that he plays them more often.

Jimbo

PS: You can come to my game anytime. [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

[JABoyd]

And yet another prfound remark:

'I didn't see where he stated that he overvalued suited cards, just that he plays them more often.'

Do you not play the hands that you value? And do you not play the hands that you place greater value on more often?

And never did I say that I dont play suited connectors more ofthen thatn unsuited connectors. That is one very specific example of suited vs. unsuited cards. All I'm saying is that most people put to much value on suitedness.

[Jimbo]

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And never did I say that I dont play suited connectors more ofthen thatn unsuited connectors. That is one very specific example of suited vs. unsuited cards. All I'm saying is that most people put to much value on suitedness.


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Actually all you did was to imply you could beat another posters game having no idea the limit, the oponnents or how the game played. So basically you wasted electrons.

Jimbo

[JABoyd]

I was being sarcastic. I've attached a link with a definition for you.

Sarcasim

[longlags]

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There are a lot of disagreeeonment on the top 10 starting hands you can have in holdem once it gets past the 4th one. For instance most sites say AA, KK, QQ, AK as the best 4 starting hands. Then some people who write articles say JJ is the 5th whereas another site has AQ as the 5th best starting hand. Then i read some ridiculous article that has KQ as the 6th and then AJ as 7th and AK offsuit as the 8th.

Personally I think Phil Hellmuths top ten starting hands
AA, KK, QQ, AKs, JJ, 1010, 99, 88, AQs and 77 is the best.

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Note that it depends on the number of players.
in 6 handed table, the correct rank will be
AA,KK,QQ,JJ,AKs,TT,AQs,KQs,AJs,AKo

KQs excpect to win more times then AJs in the long run against multiple opponents.
Ofcourse AJs dominates KQs when both in play, but against random hands KQs is a better hand.

AJs is becoming a better hand then KQs in 5 handed game and less, which makes your hunch about AJs in shape since must of the time youll play against less then 5 opponents.
That why raising with AJs makes a good play. it's reducing the num of the opponents hence gain your equity.

in hu, the whole expectation norms are different. even 22 are slightly better then AKs.

as you decrease players, the ranking of pocket pairs & the value of the high card raises up.
so, the rank is heavily depends on the number of the opponents.

[Jimbo]

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I was being sarcastic. I've attached a link with a definition for you.

Sarcasim

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So now you are trying to say this quote of yours below was only sarcasm?

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Also, the advantage of "suitedness" is somewhat less quantifiable when you consider the playability of suited cards. 2-card flushes are almost always going to be the best hand, with considerable implied odds from strong non-nut hands. So that 5% difference in pot equity conceals the implied profit: If I had to go heads up against a range like AA-JJ, I would pay twice or three times as much preflop with 87s than I would with 87o, significantly more than the 5% difference when you talk about face-up all in equity.

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Please, PLEASE, PLLLLLEASE let me know where you play!! I want in that game in a BAD WAY!!

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I suggest you never go into the sales profession, I am not buying your explanation and doubt many others here will buy it either. Your post miserably fails the irony test provided in your link.


Jimbo

[JABoyd]

You will never understand how hurt I am that you don't buy what I said or beleive it. I am quite sad now!

On a serious, non sarcastic note, please get a life JIMBO!

[formula72]

AQs beating AKo. Not according to me PokerOffice.