Misdeal or Dead Hand?

[ellenwheels]

Hand is dealt, action around the table. Guy realizes he has 4 cards. He never turned in his last hand (no shuffle machine, same deck.) There is significant action past him. Is his hand dead or is it a misdeal?

[psandman]

Dead Hand.

[LasVegasMichael]

I would agree it is a dead hand.

[ellenwheels]

That's what I think. But there appears to be an argument for misdeal as when the dealer dealt the hand, there were only 50 cards, making it a fouled deck. I still lean to dead hand.

[tom10167]

It's not that important either way, really. I lean toward dead hand because I've been in a situation like this, and it really sucks to have to give away AK for something this dumb.

[sirpupnyc]

This is similar to this recent discussion. Cards missing from the deck don't invalidate the deal. The player missed his opportunity to notice he had too many cards and get it called a misdeal. The action has gone on, so his hand is no good and everyone else's is OK.

[psandman]

I had this scenario once:


I'm dealing a $4-$8 limit game WITH A SHUFFLEMASTER. Player in Seat 10 is UTG and wins a large pot. I push the pot and the cards get buried and I forget tha haven't brought them in.

Bring out the next deck blinds are posted and I deal. After iDeal but befor ethere is any action the Large Blind (the winner of the last pot) says hey i have 4 cards and brings out his two cards from lats hand -- they are from a different deck and are obvious because of the different color backs. take his two cards from the last hand and put them into the shufflemaster and restart the Shufflemaster. Now the large Blind Announces "Misdeal" I figure he is joking an prompt the action and we get a raise in middleposition. Now he pipes up that "its a misdeal i had two many cards". I tell him they fr the other deck and different color backs, and I really can't believe that he is serious in thinking this is a misdeal. Now the action comes around to him and he starts arguing that it is a misdeal so i call the floor. The floorman is a dual rate who has been around poker a long time and knows what he is doing, but is the laziest bastard you'll ever meet. I explain what happened and the player makes is argument that it is a misdeal because he had to mnay cards, and you know what the damn floorman says. "Well i can't fix it now theres been too much action" Of course this player who started calling for a misdeal before there was nay action now thinks that he was correct and that i screwed him by calling for action instead of giving him a misdeal. (His hand was something like a 8 3 ).

So on the push I head right to the floor guy to tell him what i think of what he just did and before I even get my mouth open he says "I know. I just didn't feel like arguing with him."

[Rick Nebiolo]

Another story.

Almost twenty years ago I'm playing this $50 holdem tournament and I win a big pot with a pair or queens without having to show my hand. The pot is pushed and I'm busy stacking my chips and notice a little late that I still have my two queens. So I toss them into the middle of the table where at that moment the deck is being scrambled. What I didn't notice was that the deck had been changed. Dealer deals and BTF I fold but we have a raise and reraise and on the flop of it course comes with a queen and it was capped off as was the turn and on the river another queen comes and we have more crazy action. On the showdown I think five of the six queens were showing.

The floorman was called. He checked the deck, found the six queens, but I was so embarrassed I kept my mouth shut [img]/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img]

~ Rick

on

[crackhead]

[ QUOTE ]
Hand is dealt, action around the table. Guy realizes he has 4 cards. He never turned in his last hand (no shuffle machine, same deck.) There is significant action past him. Is his hand dead or is it a misdeal?

[/ QUOTE ]

just give everyone else 2 more cards and play omaha for this hand. [img]/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img]

joking aside, like everyone else said, hand with 4 cards is dead.

[Siegmund]

On the OP's case, yes, obviously dead. (If the table saw his hand on the previous deal, they probably ought to be announced as out-of-play like exposed cards are... don't know if he won previously with or without a showdown.)

Interesting point raised by psandman's story. When the two decks have different backs it was easy to avoid having a dead hand or a misdeal. (It would also have been REALLY easy to catch rick's incident, had the cards been different backs.)

In bridge, decks with different backs are completely standard practice -- indeed many clubs use 4 or 6 different back colours rather than just two.

Yet, in the B&M poker rooms, every room I have been to, all the decks were identical. WHY??? Making it mandatory that the two decks have different backs seems SO obvious to me...