Several Hotshots Supposedly Broke Or In Debt

[Wetdog]

Fear no more the heat o' the sun,
Nor the furious winter's rages;
Thou thy worldly task hast done,
Home art gone, and ta'en thy wages:
Golden lads and girls all must,
As chimney-sweepers, come to dust.

[MusashiStyle]

Wouldn't one expect some of the "top" players to go bust just because success in poker follows a normal bell curve.
I don't think this is particularly shocking realization.

[Jason Strasser (strassa2)]

[ QUOTE ]
i think your post is a bit uncalled for and i also feel that most people who saluted you did so because they love seeing a bloodbath, not because they believe that david deserves your comments. while some of what you say is certainly spot on, its over the top.

why would you want david to leave nvg? just because he gave a 5/10 in nvg contributions? there are hundreds of others who contribute less than he does. why dont we ban barryg because he only posts once a month? maybe david's intentions were to educate readers by painting a picture of high stakes poker in its truist form, not to tear down the images of good people whove tried hard to establish them. isnt that a noble intent?

what gives you the right for judging david on being a "lazy genius"? are you that much better? as poker players we are all leeches on others and provide no productivity for our time. im sure your wall street job will go on to save starving children in africa while reducing CO2 emissions. yes, david clearly revels in receiving gratification from the masses, but i also think its quite clear that he does enjoy educating people. he even has ambitions of writing the most effective book for teaching children algebra.

not everyone spends their life dedicating themselves to noble causes. most do what makes themselves happy, and most people would be lazy if they could afford to be. youre a really good guy in person, but your post makes you come off as a spoiled brat.

[/ QUOTE ]


Tstone, I agree with a lot of what you wrote here. My post was probably uncalled for. I also don't really think it made me come off as a spoiled brat, I'm not sure what part of my post makes me look spoiled.

[ QUOTE ]
why would you want david to leave nvg? just because he gave a 5/10 in nvg contributions? there are hundreds of others who contribute less than he does. why dont we ban barryg because he only posts once a month? maybe david's intentions were to educate readers by painting a picture of high stakes poker in its truist form, not to tear down the images of good people whove tried hard to establish them. isnt that a noble intent?

[/ QUOTE ]

I don't want David to leave NVG, I just thought his post was really lame, especially the way he worded his post. Go the finance thread where DS basically makes a post like "HAHAHA I MADE A GREAT STOCK PICK I MADE XYZ DOLLARS". I kinda read this in the same way. "LOOK EVERYONE these HOTSHOTS are broke and I was right." His style of writing was basically also indicating that he seemed superior to them because a) he has money and b) he is better/smarter. While this is also true, I was just pointing out that I'd personally much rather be a broke [censored] TV all star than be David Sklansky.

[ QUOTE ]
what gives you the right for judging david on being a "lazy genius"? are you that much better? as poker players we are all leeches on others and provide no productivity for our time. im sure your wall street job will go on to save starving children in africa while reducing CO2 emissions. yes, david clearly revels in receiving gratification from the masses, but i also think its quite clear that he does enjoy educating people. he even has ambitions of writing the most effective book for teaching children algebra.


[/ QUOTE ]

The first question is pretty obvious: David openly admits he is a lazy genius, just read the majority of his threads. In the finance forum he basically admits his really weird way of investing is flawed because he is too lazy to actually look into what a complany actually does. With his life posts, he openly admits he lacks drive to do things. I'm not judging him at all, it is a fact: Skalnsky is a lazy genius.

I guess you can say that everyone on wallstreet is a bloodsucking money whore. It might be true, I still haven't worked on wallstreet yet so I don't really know. I know something along the lines of the fact that Wallstreet makes the markets incredibly efficient and efficient markets are one of the cornerstones of our society. I personally take the stance that I can contribute (as I have to Darfur, and my mom's charity) money at this point in my life to good causes, but that my primary focus is selfish: I want to find something I enjoy waking up everyday in doing. I'm not saying I will love wallstreet--Im just giving it a shot.

I really dont think I came at DS with any type of holier than thou type [censored].

David also does not enjoy educating people. He wrote a book to make money, he limped into a TV final table to get exposure for his book. He write on 2p2 to keep the forums going and to occasionally write out interesting posts. He is a really smart guy obviously! But David would not argue with the fact that most of his education/2p2 motivations are strickly driven by dollar bills.

I didn't say David was bad or that he has to dedicate his life to noble causes. I was merely pointing out that I dont think that highly of extremely educated/smart people who talk down to everyone yet seem to live a life marked by laziness. I'd rather be XYZ random broke guy living/following/failing at a dream.

[Chump Change]

[ QUOTE ]
I could do a lot more myself but I have taught thousands of people how to think better. How many people do you think care one way or the other whether any of these other players even exist?

[/ QUOTE ]

[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]

[Chomp]

Anyone who doesn't feel a secret twinge of joy at the busto nightmares of others isn't human.

[Jason Strasser (strassa2)]

David,

I obviously misread what you said about Guy, I thought you were talking about him losing money through someone, which was a transparent call out on Booth who is rumored to be in tough times these days. I also like Brad a lot.

I'll also be willing to admit that my comment about you moving around a lot in Bellagio is off topic and didn't really add anything to my post, so I'll apologize for the offtopic attack.

As Diablo's post said, your original post was basically 100% pointless and as I said in my reply to Tstone, I basically read it as you bragging in some way.

David, you have obviously taught people a ton. I learned from your books and a lot through 2p2 and have done really well. I still think that your motivations are likely 100% selfish, but that's sort of irrelevant and I am obviously greatful.

[ QUOTE ]
We are talking about poker players here. people who are willing to lose millions on the turn of a card while others are starving in Africa. People who are smart and talented enough that they could be doining a lot more for the world. I could do a lot more myself but I have taught thousands of people how to think better. How many people do you think care one way or the other whether any of these other players even exist?

[/ QUOTE ]

I'm not quite sure what you are getting at. So because you have taught something to tons of people, you have sone more to help starving children in Africa?

And yes, I am glad you exist and of these players going busto, I don't really care that they exist. I've given shoutouts to 2p2 in Businessweek magazine, Sports Illustrated, Bluff, and the Duke magazine, so obviously I'm greatful yadda yadda. But I still dont get how any of this has anything to do with children in Africa?

[David Sklansky]

"David also does not enjoy educating people."

There you are wrong. Although I would rather it not be about poker.

Meanwhile I got the feeling your diatribe was to a large degree spurred by something related to Brad Booth. Is that true?

[Chump Change]

[ QUOTE ]
David also does not enjoy educating people. He wrote a book to make money, he limped into a TV final table to get exposure for his book. He write on 2p2 to keep the forums going and to occasionally write out interesting posts. He is a really smart guy obviously! But David would not argue with the fact that most of his education/2p2 motivations are strickly driven by dollar bills.

[/ QUOTE ]

Strasser,

You know as well as I do, or you should, as should everybody, that the argument stating such and such a person is not noble and altruistic in their efforts to teach will never go anywhere and will always be neither here nor there.

In this society making money is a necessity, so the nobility or lack thereof in one's actions can never and will never be viewed in a vacuum. Plus, it is presumptuous to assume the two must be mutually exclusive.

Imo this is the only thing truly out of line and an outright besmirching of David's integrity, challenging his motivations when you have no true intimate knowledge of the workings of his brain and base it only on some posts on an internet forum, half of which are so tonque-in-cheek it's absurd. I believe an apology is in order.

[Jason Strasser (strassa2)]

[ QUOTE ]
When Jason Strasser becomes a man, he will put away childish things, especially this rude, misinformed way of writing. There are a large number of young poker players who are winning tournaments and surreal sums of money. It is natural to be conceited and intellectually isolated, like Strasser. Calling Sklansky an underacheiver marks him.

Sklansky is the leading theorist in poker. Since his books, the field has gotten a whole lot tougher and he is one of the reasons. I've seen Sklanskly win a tournament on TV, playing against top talent. Success is self-defined. Sklansky has been a huge success for a very long time and we know this will continue.

Many poker players save up money, many go broke. It is often because of leaks rather than poker: dice, sports, coke, alcohol, women, and self-importance.

Remember High School English. Pride causes the fall. This year's hot shots come and go and Las Vegas doesn't even pretend to care.

If you were to bet on who is likely to go broke, Sklansky or Strasser, what price would you lay?

[/ QUOTE ]

Johnny Hughes,

First of all if you see DS's reply to my thread he was far less offended than you. The only thing childish, which I will agree with, was my attack on his Bellagio poker room habbits which just annoy the heck out of me when I play with him, I just threw that in there for selfish/childish reasons.

Sklansky will not argue with the fact that he underachieves, so the fact that you are calling me out for calling DS out for underachieving is silly. I've read a lot that DS has written about himself.

Yes Sklansky has had a lot of success in poker, did you read my post? Where did I question any of this?

I don't think David will ever end up broke, and there is obviously a much larger chance I go broke given my age, my lifestyle, blah blah. DS will almost certainly never go broke. I'm pretty good with money, but I like to take chances and I would say there is likely a point in my life where I will try to start a business or get involved in something like that, where there will be a real risk of me going broke.

So what on earth was your point with this post?

[Jason Strasser (strassa2)]

Yes. My diatribe was triggered because I thought you were doing one of those " I cant say XYZ is broke but..." then basically calling him out. Oopsies