*ATTN Winstar Players*

[internetdonk]

Fat Emmit loves to say "If you want comps go to vegas"..They have no idea how to run a poker room. All the floor people do is act like cell phone natzies yelling at people who talk on their phone while sitting at a table, even if thery are not in a hand. they have crap weekly tournys and crap service... Its only a matter of time before they wonder what happened to their customers..

[Dealer-Guy]

So where will you play?

I'm sure it's just a coincidence that your name is "RedMan"?

[rageotones]

i didn't waste my time reading this whole thing, but why the f#$% is anyone comparing a vegas cardroom to an oklahoma cardroom?

it's like, why the hell do people pay 3.50 a gallon for gas in CA when it's only 2.50 in TX....OLdjfoijefoijew oijef idiots!!!!!!!!

[hime]

[ QUOTE ]
One dealer failed to recognize that 65 beats 95 on a JJ652 board. She insisted on pushing the pot to 95 and even called the floor when we all insisted that a pair of 6s beats a pair of 5s. I am not making this up.

[/ QUOTE ]

Which dealer was this?

[hime]

[ QUOTE ]

One player per hand, one dealer per table please!

[/ QUOTE ]

I had my reasons for telling the redhead kittenface to table his hand. I'll never do it again, I swear.

[TxRedMan]

[ QUOTE ]
So where will you play?

I'm sure it's just a coincidence that your name is "RedMan"?

[/ QUOTE ]


I live in Dallas, and I play in one room here. Yes, I used to play there, but anymore it's too big. The room I play at in Dallas caters to an affluent upscale type of crowd, and has reputable owners and is in a safe and secure location, including two doors and a security guard. I'm often asked by other 2p2'ers if I'd introduce them to the room, but I nearly always decline unless they have a long and solid reputation with other people I know.

That said I'll be playing here in Dallas, on Full Tilt, and you can usually find me in Las Vegas every other week.

My intention with this post is to inform players who otherwise wouldn't know what it's like in other card rooms, and hopefully make some changes or at least let the management at Winstar know there are many players who either play there and are unhappy, or there are many players like myself who would give them their action and help build a reputation for the room if they'd become competitive with other rooms in the country, and stop abusing the monopoly they're fortunate enough to have in the short term. If nothing else I hope I've made the point clear to some recreational players who play at Winstar that the effect of the rake is much greater than they might have ever considered, and if there was a room nearby that took care of the players like any number of rooms in Las Vegas, they'd probably never set foot in Winstar again and feel cheated for putting up with that [censored].



-Tex

[TxRedMan]

[ QUOTE ]
why the f#$% is anyone comparing a vegas cardroom to an oklahoma cardroom?



[/ QUOTE ]



Because they're both card rooms, they both cater to the same people, nearly all the variables are the same, and the difference between the two is a huge discrepancy in terms of quality of services provided?

I think you're the idiot if you propose that we shouldn't compare one card room to another because one is in Nevada, the other in Oklahoma. It's akin to saying some third world country shouldn't complain about tyranny and try to do something about it just because there's a democratic society somewhere else that shouldn't be compared to it. Tell me what the [censored] is wrong with trying to inform players and create a situation that might potentially lead to a better deal for the players?



-Tex

[hime]

I am not the biggest fan of the way Winstar runs their room, as many locals are all too aware. And I'm certainly a grumpy nit, especially when I am stuck. A lot of people (however wrongly) are willing to give respect or deference to my opinion when it comes to matters of the rules, structures, etc. I am still a n00b compared to, oh, say somebody who ran an underground card room.

That said, I have been playing at Winstar for a while now. The old room was a frigging nightmare, but it made do. They moved into the new room, and everything was a mess there at first. But they're making baby steps all the time. By the size of their room and the captive market, I think they're pretty much guaranteed to not be screwed any time soon, unless Texas legalizes poker. Which believe you me, I want that more than you do. Give me a room right on the western border of Denton and I'd be there a ton.

But until that day, Winstar is what we have. They have a long way to go, but talking to some of the people in the room has me realizing this:

They actually give a [censored]. No, really. Their biggest problem was room capacity. That problem has been solved. Now they have other smaller issues to work on. But it's going to take time. And it's going to take trying things that may or may not work, like the thing with the remotes to page seat open and such. (They should have given that more time.)

But when you have a floor (Craig) telling you that they're working on maybe doing limit tourneys (eg LHE and LO8), it shows that they actually do care and are working on it.

As for the guy complaining about the rake and putting together a 20/40 guy, he's a nice enough guy, but he seems to tell some stories. Says he plays a PLO game with Kido Pham and TJ Cloutier. But they won't play at Winstar because the rake is too high. So, Asian high roller dude:

Why are you playing 4/8 at Winstar?
Where are you playing this game where the rake is less than $5 a pot? It's either an underground cardroom (where the rake is VERY likely higher) or TJ or Kido's house (in which case I would assume NO rake).
Does somebody playing 20/40 really care when the rake is 1/8 BB? Is that extra dollar really going to make a difference?

It's just weird that you come along not too long after I had that convo with that guy (couple weeks ago) and nits things up along the same lines. And you just happen to be named "TxRedman". For those who don't know, a rather famous cardroom in Dallas was called Redman's.

A cynical sort of logic would say you're angling to try and get your old high limit players back. But then, you should have a certain amount of loyalty among that customer base, and the games don't generally go that high anyway.

And yes, I am just a casual (winning, but not lately) 4/8 player. And yes, everyone on 2+2 says that a $5+1 rake at 4/8 is the end of the world and you will die in a grease fire playing it. But this isn't Vegas, and this is what we have.

*shrug* I'm playing online these days until I can get a live bankroll back together. And in November, I'll be playing a HORSE tourney at Cherokee in Tulsa, because those guys seem to REALLY know what they're doing. Ah well, everything takes time.

[TxRedMan]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
One dealer failed to recognize that 65 beats 95 on a JJ652 board. She insisted on pushing the pot to 95 and even called the floor when we all insisted that a pair of 6s beats a pair of 5s. I am not making this up.

[/ QUOTE ]

Which dealer was this?

[/ QUOTE ]


I bet if you asked every dealer at Winstar to identify the winning hand on this board, the majority would get it wrong.


A-K-2-3
vs
4-5-6-7

Board

J-5-7-J-J

If you saw this example and had to think twice, you've no business dealing an omaha game.

[hime]

[ QUOTE ]

My intention with this post is to inform players who otherwise wouldn't know what it's like in other card rooms, and hopefully make some changes or at least let the management at Winstar know there are many players who either play there and are unhappy, or there are many players like myself who would give them their action and help build a reputation for the room if they'd become competitive with other rooms in the country, and stop abusing the monopoly they're fortunate enough to have in the short term. If nothing else I hope I've made the point clear to some recreational players who play at Winstar that the effect of the rake is much greater than they might have ever considered, and if there was a room nearby that took care of the players like any number of rooms in Las Vegas, they'd probably never set foot in Winstar again and feel cheated for putting up with that [censored].

[/ QUOTE ]

Oh believe you me, all the smarter players (recreational or not) are keenly aware that if a room opened with better rake and comps what would happen. But for now, that's just a wish.

I'm not saying you have no right to complain, I'm one of the complainiest people around. I'm just saying that a bit more pragmatism may be useful.

And any locals are welcome at my home game. .50/1 mixed HORSEP. BALLER!