Just Saw Sicko, Now Have Question

[Lucky]

If we could, lets get back to original question in this thread. What plan is in place amongst the upper middle class and wealthier for insanely expensive long term illness? You hit your insurance cap and then what? Is everyone here just figuring they'll roll the dice?

[The4Aces]

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And taxes are not theft because you choose to live here and be a US citizen(or a citizen of basically almost any developed country you reside in), and so you have to pay taxes. If you don't like it, then you can leave. This is different from a robber holding a gun to your head because the robber doesn't give you the choice to walk away from him.

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You cant renounce your citizenship for tax reasons. Also your logic is horrible. It would be like me saying if you dont like the status quo then just move to a country where you like the status quo. For example YOU could move to all these great places that have universial health care if you dont like how the system currently is in the US.

[The4Aces]

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If healthcare is a BASIC HUMAN RIGHT is it right for a country to take military action against another if the people of the second country are not reciving government provided health care? What about economic sanctions?

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Um no it wouldn't. That's a decision each country should make on their own. No economic sanctions either.

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If healthcare is a human right should we provide everyone on earth healthcare? If not why not?

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Ideally that would be nice, but we have limited resources and need to take care of our own citizens.

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Isnt this a bad attitude to take? It shows me that you dont really belive health care is a human right. We have had economic sanctions on countries that violated human rights in the past. (I think we still do with cuba, North Korea, and Iran but I am not sure).

Your second statement also has flowed logic. Human rights know no borders so why use a geographic or national region to decide who gets the benifit of these programs?

Do you belive it is a human right to feel secure in ones possessions?

[kyleb]

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Kyleb,

"It's worth noting that I do these things. I'm not heartless, I just think government is both inefficient and corrupt."

Are you making the claim that private companies or foundations are free from inefficiency and/or corruption?

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No, not at all. Just because I think public institutions are corrupt and are rarely accountable to anyone doesn't suddenly mean that private institutions are the mirror image.

Private institutions have competition - namely, themselves. Who competes with public institutions? It's a simple economic tidbit - when monopolies exist, price gouging almost always occurs.

[kyleb]

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Furthermore, taxes really aren't theft. If you don't wish to pay them, you can go to a different country that has fewer taxes or spends tax dollars in a way you find appropriate.

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Doesn't work that way, and I think you know that. Stop being intellectually dishonest.

[kyleb]

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IT IS govt's job imo to make sure everyone has a minimum standard of living, ie adequate health care and at least some opportunity to better themselves through education to kind of level the playing field, because some people start off way ahead of others in the game of life. i do not begrudge rich people their wealth/income at all.

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Your problem is this: You say "government" as if it's an entity that popped up out of nowhere and can provide services magically. Here's the kicker: "Government" is us. You and me.

I don't want a "minimum standard of living." You do. Why should you get your way?

[goodgrief]

Long term nursing care is not covered under your health insurance in the United States. If you require long term nursing care with no prospect of getting better, if you don't have the special long term care insurance, then eventually you do bankrupt your family. Most people under 40 don't have this insurance, and I've seen advisors suggest that you not bother to purchase it before age 50. Reason: There is some doubt that the companies will be able to meet their obligations going that far forward into the future. It can be terribly expensive in any case if you qualify to buy it at all. So I don't know what to tell you. I gave up on reading the rest of the thread when I realized that it had degenerated into a political debate, instead of practical advice. Possibly this is because there is no practical advice to be had. I've heard of older couples making such choices as suicide or divorce to prevent the healthy spouse from being left out on the street when the severely disabled spouse has no chance of recovery.

[goodgrief]

OK, I think I answered your question in the wrong place. For the most part, as far as I know, especially for younger people, there isn't any alternative to "just rolling the dice." If you are still healthy and wealthy at age 50, you may qualify to purchase long term care insurance. It's usually expensive. The insurer is taking quite a risk. One of my relatives who suffered from dementia was in care for around two decades.


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If we could, lets get back to original question in this thread. What plan is in place amongst the upper middle class and wealthier for insanely expensive long term illness? You hit your insurance cap and then what? Is everyone here just figuring they'll roll the dice?

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[jws43yale]

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Emperor, I would rather have people have to wait a few months for elective non-medically necessary surgery than have people dying of cancer or other diseases because they don't have the money for treatment and don't have insurance. The greed displayed in this thread is astounding.


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The US has the highest cancer survival rates, etc. as shown earlier. No one just dies because they can't get treatment for a serious condition here. And yes I am sure you can quote me some story just like others have quoted atypical Canadian wait times.

The US has the highest survival rate but as a result of private care it is true that poor will be on the lower end of survival rates and the rich will be at the top. It is selfish of me, but I want the highest chance of survival possible if I can afford it, not to settle for a lower chance in a free healthcare system.

[Vagos]

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Libertarianism, in it's pure form, implemented in a country the size of the US, would be the biggest human catastrophe the earth has ever known.

Discuss.

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Over time it definitely would be. If given enough time, casualties would match that of Stalin and Hitler.

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The instant someone talks about AC being "implemented" is the instant I realize they misunderstand the position they are arguing against.

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i love your cheap semantics. ok, fine, i'll use your lingo. removing the fascist power structure is analagous to implementing AC.

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Haha, you just blindly assert (no proof, no argument, nothing) that AC would match the horror and destruction of two of the worst dictatorships in human history and I'm the one playing cheap?