Live $3/6: bottom set, drawy board, multivay pot

[No1Addict]

Hi all,

Here's a strange hand I've played this weekend. Please let me know what you'd put villains on and what line you'd take on the flop.

UTG: Folds
UTG+1: Folds
UTG+2($130): Calls
MP1 ($450): Calls
MP2: Folds
CO ($1300): Calls
Button ($460): Calls
SB: Completes
Hero ($410): Checks (8 [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]8 [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img])

Flop ($36): 8 [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]Q [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]9 [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]

SB checks, <font color="red"> Hero bets $25 </font> , UTG+2 calls $25, <font color="red"> MP1 raises to $125 </font> , CO calls $125, Button calls $125, SB folds, <font color="red"> Hero? </font>

Reads: UTG+2 – Very loose, passive. Lost a big pot to CO with top two vs. top set and is steaming.
MP1: Loose aggressive. Is the strongest player at the table but still not a great one. I’ve played with him before and he is prone to be too aggressive with marginal hands. So far has played few hands this session.
CO: Loose passive preflop, very aggressive if he hits. Was very lucky so far and won 2 big pots when he flopped a set over top two pair and then turned a boat vs. a flopped flush. He had aces once and he limped in middle position.
Button: Loose passive, ‘check the nuts’ type. He’s seen a lot of flops today and is complaining about not connecting.

I’m being perceived as a tight passive player. I started with $600 and lost a few pots recently.


The pot is now $461, I have $379 behind and only $31 invested. What to do and why?

[hielo_uno]

if there is a time to for a set, this is it. you got two callers for the 3bet and a player behind you, you are only beating two pairs and draws which got alot of outs against you. FOLD!

[jetsetboy]

Is this live?

A set with less than 100bb =&gt; get all the money in the fastest u can. Simply push.

[No1Addict]

Yes, it's live. My weekly game, lots of passive players me included.

I've been trying to be more aggresive and this is a spot where a laydown just seams weak.

I'm thinking any draws would steal eachother's outs so they may not be that strong.

[DrClaw]

Seems to me like the button's flat calling is the only thing that you really have to be worried about. If the original raiser is as aggressive as you say, he's earned your call because he could be fighting with a hand you have dominated.

If the button will simply smooth call with a set of 9s or the nuts multiway (as you've said) you have to try to get a read on him about how comfortable he is in the hand.

In the end, unless you are confident that the button has 9s, then I think you just have to lose your short stack with a set here. You'll be ahead much of the time, and even when up against JT you have some outs.

[rdrr]

No-brainer shove in my opinion

[PoppaTMan]

Hand Ranges -
MP1: JTo, JTs, Q8s, Q9s, [T[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]-A[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], X[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]].
CO: QQ, 99, Q9s, Q8s, QJo, QJs, [T[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]-A[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] , X[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]]
Button: JTo, JTs, QQ, 99, Q9s, Q8s, [Q[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]-A[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] , X[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]]

The only problem that exists is that two of the players remaining in the hand have the possibility to hold the two hands that have you crushed (99, QQ). However, I believe we can weigh CO's chances of holding these hands lighter due to him being aggressive when hitting.

With the drawiness of the board, shoving becomes the obvious play due to the following:

- No one is folding anything, unless MP1 somehow has air.
- Often: You get a ton of money in good when you are ahead against opponents who are holding each others' outs.
- Occasionally: You are behind, but the overlay you get on your shove is good enough to call with anyway to draw to your boat. So you might as well be the aggressor.
- Very rarely: You're crushed, but god damnit you still have one out!

Since you play with these guys regularly, shoving has additional bonuses besides the obvious immediate +EV. Whenever you widen your range for making value plays like these, it gives you room to make more big bluffs since your range is no longer limited to the nuts. Obviously this becomes less important against the not-so-observant, drooler types. Anyway, I hope you made the correct decision in the hand.

[No1Addict]

Hi all,

Thanks a lot for the replies! I shoved but I was not at all sure this was +EV all things considered.

I thought that the only people who could have me crushed are the UTG+2 guy and the button. As you've noticed, that's the button's MO so he could very well have a set, TJ but draws are also in his range because he is passive.

MP1 I thought had TP2K (He would have raised AQ, QQ or 99 pf because he loves to raise).

CO got me puzzled because he usually was aggresive with good hands post flop but I also knew he wouldn't put his money in without a good hand. I thought he had the draw.

BTN can have anything really at this point. He may be slow playing a straight or have some weird hand like A9 with the A of diamonds (I've seen plays like this from him before).

UTG+2 is the same type as button but he has like a third of my stack so I didn't worry about him much.

So I shove.
UTG+2 calls all in with top two pairs.
MP1 goes all in with K [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]K [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (yes, I misjudged him big time)
CO folds A [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]A [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (I would have bet my house against him holing aces)
BTN calls all in with Q [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]J [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]


Before I share results, what hands do you thing should have called here and which were loose calls?

[KurtSF]

UTG+2 is an easy call with his stack. The rest are pretty ill-advised after your b3b.

[PoppaTMan]

Yeah, UTG+2 call was fine. MP1 shove is just so so awful. BTN call *if* you can see the other hands face up (aka no diamond draws) is close, but still -EV. Without complete information, it's just terrible.

Well played by hero!