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  #21  
Old 11-20-2007, 09:19 AM
Bremen Bremen is offline
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Default Re: I need a serious workhorse computer for complex simulations

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If you can talk to the programmer why not just ask him what would be best?

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He doesn't know anything about hardware. He didn't even know how to hook up a bluetooth printer adapter. [img]/images/graemlins/frown.gif[/img] But, on the bright side, he's supposed to be the best grad student in the CS dept when it comes to programming C++ and Java. Go figure.

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Dear lord, he should at least know what the memory usage is. They don't teach kids anything these days. *grumble grumble*

Anyway you'll need a system with enough memory to contain the program (if you don't have disk activity while running than whatever you have is good enough). Which leaves just getting the fastest processor you can get. With your budget you might be able to swing dual quad core Xeons.
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  #22  
Old 11-20-2007, 02:03 PM
nuclear500 nuclear500 is offline
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Default Re: I need a serious workhorse computer for complex simulations

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I will add this. Given the computational parameters in your original post, it seems to me that a dual quad-core system would be overkill. You could probably get by with something smaller for much less.

That's just semi-informed personal opinion though. I can't provide any evidence to back that up.

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Would depend on how many threads are being run or how many individual processes are being started.

If its a truly multi-threaded application, the more core's the better...though I don't know how well Mac OS scales for CPUs. Windows tends to stop scaling decently after 4, though it still utilizes the processors, just less effectively as Windows doesn't pin the scheduler to a particular CPU. But since Mac is built off of Unix, it might do better with up to 8.
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  #23  
Old 11-20-2007, 02:14 PM
mustmuck mustmuck is offline
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Default Re: I need a serious workhorse computer for complex simulations

Ganjasaurus, he has to know if it's multithreaded or not. Find out! It matters!
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  #24  
Old 11-20-2007, 02:37 PM
Freakin Freakin is offline
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Default Re: I need a serious workhorse computer for complex simulations

I'd probably go with server hardware and get a high quality motherboard that can take 8-16GB of FB memory.

Raid 1 is probably a good idea also, since I'm guessing losing all your data would be bad. Raid 1 means it's constantly writing the same data to both harddrives so if one fails you don't lose any data. This does not replace the necessity of backups, however.

The most important thing to figure out directly from the programmer is whether or not it is multithreaded, like nuclear500 said.

Multithreaded means that there are different 'parts' of the program that can be assigned to multiple processors. If it's not multithreaded, you need the best 'core' of a processor you can afford; you won't benefit from dual-core, quad-core, or dual processors unless you are running your simulation many times at once.

If it IS multithreaded, then you should look at good multi-core systems.

Personally I would try to get quad-core xeons on a server board, and probably get 2 10k or 15k RPM SAS drives in Raid 1. A good raid controller is also probably important.
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  #25  
Old 11-20-2007, 03:00 PM
Ganjasaurus Rex Ganjasaurus Rex is offline
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Default Re: I need a serious workhorse computer for complex simulations

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Ganjasaurus, he has to know if it's multithreaded or not. Find out! It matters!

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I asked the programmer, and he says it is multi-threaded.
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  #26  
Old 11-20-2007, 03:02 PM
Ganjasaurus Rex Ganjasaurus Rex is offline
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Default Re: I need a serious workhorse computer for complex simulations

Thanks Freakin!


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Personally I would try to get quad-core xeons on a server board, and probably get 2 10k or 15k RPM SAS drives in Raid 1. A good raid controller is also probably important.

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Sorry to sound ignorant again, but is this something i can show our computer tech dept so they can order it? Or do i need more details for them?
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  #27  
Old 11-20-2007, 03:44 PM
Freakin Freakin is offline
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Default Re: I need a serious workhorse computer for complex simulations

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Thanks Freakin!


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Personally I would try to get quad-core xeons on a server board, and probably get 2 10k or 15k RPM SAS drives in Raid 1. A good raid controller is also probably important.

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Sorry to sound ignorant again, but is this something i can show our computer tech dept so they can order it? Or do i need more details for them?

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If your computer tech department has a guy responsible for building and configuring servers, then he should be able to shop for what you need.

It's been a while since I looked around, but I think the Intel Xeon Clovertown are still the best.

Something like the 5355 or 5345 are probably the best pricepoint for you

http://www.newegg.com/Product/ProductLis...name=Clovertown

You'd also want to get fully buffered (FB) dimms for your memory.

I honestly can't recommend a good motherboard since it's been too long since I shopped for one. Your computer department guys should be able to.

So tell them you want 1 or 2 Xeon Clovertown X5355's, 8-16GB of Fully Buffered memory.

I honestly don't know if you want high-speed storage or more spacious storage. If you're getting 10-15k RPM drives then the biggest drive you'll be getting is 74-150GB, and it will be expensive. Expect to pay about $300-350 for 74GB of 15kRPM Serial Attached SCSI (SAS). This will be faster performance, but possibly not necessary for your uses.

From the way you've described it, it sounds like you don't need high speed storage. You'd probably benefit from having your OS on a 10k RPM drive, but you can get a Western Digital Raptor drive for $180 or so that is 150GB of 10kRPM storage. This would be easy and cost-effective.
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  #28  
Old 11-20-2007, 04:19 PM
Ganjasaurus Rex Ganjasaurus Rex is offline
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Default Re: I need a serious workhorse computer for complex simulations

Awesome. Thanks for your help!
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  #29  
Old 11-20-2007, 05:19 PM
Bremen Bremen is offline
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Default Re: I need a serious workhorse computer for complex simulations

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Awesome. Thanks for your help!

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Just to give you an idea this is a server I spec'd out at dell for $1,765. I did an Apple as well but that came out to $4,754 (to be fair the apple did use better processors). Needless to say if you can get the programmer to make it work on linux you can save yourself a ton of money. Also the machine displayed below neglects memory/disks since it sounds like these are not critical for your current application. If you intend to do anything with this after your current research is complete it would almost certainly be a good idea to upgrade both following Freakin's suggestions.


# PowerEdge SC1430


Date 11/20/2007 2:51:18 PM Central Standard Time
Catalog Number 4 Retail 04
Catalog Number / Description Product Code SKU Id
PowerEdge SC1430:
Quad Core Intel® Xeon® E5335; 2X4MB Cache, 2.0GHz, 1333MHZ FSB 143E20 [223-1438] 1
2nd Processor:
Quad Core Intel® Xeon® E5335; 2X4MB Cache, 2.0GHz, 1333MHZ FSB 2PE20 [311-7416] 2
Operating System:
No Operating System NOOS [420-6320] 11
Memory:
2GB 667MHz (2x1GB), Dual Ranked Fully Buffered DIMMs 2G2D6S [311-6152] 3
Hard Drive Configuration:
Onboard SATA Controller supports 1-2 Hard Drives - No RAID MSTNR [341-3825] 27
Hard Drive Controller:
Onboard SATA Controller - No RAID OBSATA [430-1949] 9
Primary Hard Drive:
80GB 7.2K RPM Serial ATA 3Gbps 3.5-in Cabled Hard Drive, Primary 80S272 [341-3757] 8
2nd Hard Drive:
80GB 7.2K RPM Serial ATA 3Gbps 3.5-in Cabled Hard Drive, Additional 80S2A72 [341-3763] 23
Floppy Drive:
No Floppy Drive NOFD [341-4035] 10
CD/DVD Drive:
48X CD-RW/DVD ROM Drive CDRWDVD [313-4337] 16
Network Adapter:
On-Board Single Gigabit Network Adapter OBNIC [430-0488] 13
System Documentation:
Electronic Documentation and OpenManage CD Kit EDOCS [310-8146] 21
Keyboard:
No Keyboard Option NOKYB [310-5017] 4
Mouse:
No Mouse Option NOMSE [320-2346] 12
Monitor:
No Monitor Option NOMON [320-0058] 5
Hardware Support Services:
3Yr STANDARD SUPPORT: 7x24 Tech HW/SW Support, NBD Onsite After Diagnosis 3STDU [970-6242][970-6282][980-2590][985-0848][985-0857] 29
Installation Support Services:
No Installation Assessment NOINSTL [900-9997] 32
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