Daniel's book - Sold Out

[Mason Malmuth]

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Nope I think I grasped it pretty well and it's horse [censored]. How does the price of a book affect how many orders will be placed.

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The price of a book can significantly affect the number of orders that are placed. (Your post show you have little understanding of this business.) We had a conversation with our book buyer for one of the major chains concerning one of our books approximately two years ago. His comment was that at $29.95 they would purchase it aggressively, but at $34.95 they would still buy it but the amount of the order would be significantly cut back. Keep in mind that if you don't have the book on the bookstore shelves, you're not going to sell very many.

MM

[Wetdog]

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I think Dan Harrington qualfies as a celebrity endorsement.

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For most of us here at 2+2 I would agree. To the average schlub looking to buy a book to learn how to play poker, Daniel's name is worth his weight in gold theoretically. Harington's celebrity would not be as big a factor as it would be for Daniel. But as Mason already pointed out, book reviews and peer acceptance - the quality of the finished book - far outweighs other factors in the long run.

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I would think that, to the average schlub, Daniel is seen on TV more, is more photogenic and charismatic and has a more exciting style. So they weigh that and the price of the book being half of HOH and it's a done deal. That's ok to me though. I'd rather they buy what could be read online for free and then spew more money to me.

[Daniel Negreanu]

I wouldn't exactly call the book a "celebrity endorsement" but if that's the proper term than so be it. I wrote the whole thing, I didn't endorse someone else's writing.

As for my big book that's in the works, I do think the fact that I have a lengthy track record in the game adds a lot to making people want to buy it. If I were to buy a book on,"How to stay happily married for 50+ years," I wouldn't buy it if the author was a single guy who's never been married. What could he know about it?

When Dan Harrington writes a book on no limit hold'em tournaments, it has credibility because he has proven, time and time again, that he can win big money in tournament poker.

Now, if say, Mason were to write a book entitled, "How to win million dollar poker tournaments," I can't imagine it would be something that I'd be interested in buying, if the choices were that book, or Dan Harrington's book.

[*TT*]

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Now, if say, Mason were to write a book entitled, "How to win million dollar poker tournaments," I can't imagine it would be something that I'd be interested in buying, if the choices were that book, or Dan Harrington's book.

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True, but Mason probably would not write a book on tournaments because its not what he does. But if he did take a stab in the dark, at least we can assume from his past proven track record that it would be good, and he would probably be making a better royalty than you [img]/images/graemlins/wink.gif[/img] Theoretically he only would need to sell 1/2 the number of books since it would sell for $29.95 to turn a greater profit for the author. Is it obvious that I'm in a nit-picky mood?

OK back to reality - I'm your biggest fan and biggest critic of your TD 2-7 section in SSII. It was hands down the best section in the book, but if you spent a little more time editing your concepts, added a discussion on odds & pot equity (its only needed when the pot is bloated or very small but its still a missing topic), and expanded greatly on the river I think it would have been flawless. Take your time, don't let anyone rush you and don't miss any tiny details. Deliver the flawless book that you want to write. Everyone has high hopes for your next book, I hope you live up to our expectations!

[MrFizzbin]

I think Harringtons success got me to buy the first book. The fact that the first one was so good got me to buy the second and third.

I'm still wondering if Daniels first book will come with a copy of Stacked.. Cause lord only knows I need a another coaster for my house.

[edfurlong]

How do you feel about the poker video game Stacked?

[SuperUberBob]

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I'm still wondering if Daniels first book will come with a copy of Stacked.. Cause lord only knows I need a another coaster for my house.

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lol QFT

[Mason Malmuth]

Hi TT:

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True, but Mason probably would not write a book on tournaments because its not what he does. But if he did take a stab in the dark, at least we can assume from his past proven track record that it would be good, and he would probably be making a better royalty than you

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I'm going to take this one step further. My best guess is that Doyle Brunson cost himself at least $1 million in royalties by not going with us, and perhaps as much as $3 million. I don't know Daniel's deal with his publisher (who's the same as Brunson's), but assuming he does produce a very good book, there's a good chance the numbers would be similar.

Our royalty rates run as high as 50 percent of wholesale which is equivalent to 25 percent of retail. These are rates that are virtually unheard of in the publishing business.

And one final thought, if I was to write a tournament book, it would sell well because we wouldn't publish it if it wasn't good. Don't forget, we at Two Plus Two do have access to experts who would give us comments, and this would include David Sklansky and Dan Harrington, to make sure it was good.

By the way, we do like Daniel at Two Plus Two and there is no question that he's a gifted player. What he needs to understand about me is that a bunch of years ago I made the decision that our publishing company, and not my poker playing career, is where my main efforts would go. It's perhaps the best decision I ever made.

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OK back to reality - I'm your biggest fan and biggest critic of your TD 2-7 section in SSII. It was hands down the best section in the book, but if you spent a little more time editing your concepts, added a discussion on odds & pot equity (its only needed when the pot is bloated or very small but its still a missing topic), and expanded greatly on the river I think it would have been flawless. Take your time, don't let anyone rush you and don't miss any tiny details. Deliver the flawless book that you want to write. Everyone has high hopes for your next book, I hope you live up to our expectations!

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This is incredibly good advice. The world of poker books has changed from what it was years ago when I started. Many authors out there don't realize how important it is to have their books very well written and produced in all aspects. Twenty years ago when Two Plus Two first began, this wasn't the case, but it is the case now.

I have been critical of Daniel's writing in the past, and I'm sure he hasn't enjoyed those comments. But Daniel, as TT mentioned, have a professional editor go over your work, especially someone who is very good at tightening up the language. If you don't know one, contact me privately and I can recommend an editor. Do you really want to publish a book where someone can come along and simply cross out every third or fourth word and then it reads better?

And one final thought. While I agree that's Daniel's
"Triple Draw" in SS2 is quite good, my favorite section is the Omaha eight-or-better. But that's probably because, though virtually no one knows this, I had a little something to do with it.

best wishes,
Mason

[sublyme]

I also believe Mason's statement about needing Negreanu to sell more books is foolish, and I've read this entire thread. Let's say 200,000 copies have been sold of HOH1 - if the book were only $15, should we expect that 400,000 copies have been sold? No, because the market has shown so far that only 200,000 purchasers have wanted a copy, despite it's price.

Ok, so let's take into account that it's "too expensive", thus limiting the sales on the books - does this mean that if HOH1 was suddenly $15 we should expect more copies sold simply because now there is a section of people who can afford it? Not realistically, because anybody who is genuinely interested in purchasing the book will find a way despite a $15 price difference.

True, Mason has a point in the fact that a cheaper book will have book stores buy more copies and in turn put more on the shelves, but this does *NOT* translate to a higher number of sales - how often do you have to go from bookstore to bookstore looking for a copy of Harrington on Hold' Em because it is sold out?

I rest my case; I can see why Mason would say something like that, but in the end it boils down to Mason trying to equate price with quality, and quality simply isn't something you can place a number value on, especially since what is quality to man A is incomprehensible to man B, and so forth.

[Mason Malmuth]

Hi sublyme:

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how often do you have to go from bookstore to bookstore looking for a copy of Harrington on Hold' Em because it is sold out?


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This was an interesting aspect of Harrington I. When it first appeared the reception was so positive that it not only quickly sold out, but the replacement orders also quickly sold out, and so on. Because of it's success, the initial orders for our future books were up, as is shown by the numbers I gave. So unknown to most of you, the Harrington books, and in particular Harrington I had a significant impact on not only our company, but the whole poker book business as well.

Best wishes,
Mason