seriously why do i keep stacking off with qq pf?

Victor · #1 08-16-2007, 04:18 PM

took azk, et al, advice and started 3bettin qq pf.

so now when the tag 4bets or pushes, i was ridiculed for even mentioning folding by a few others.

cool. just checked my last 16k hands. aipf with qq 4 times and lost all to better hands.

cool, lets check my other allins pf. aipf 7 other times. was against qq 4 times, aa once, aks once and jj once. jj was against a 50/25 lag fwiw.

azk and others please forgive me for my skepticism.

Josh. · #2 08-16-2007, 05:26 PM

bad luck comes in different forms. you know this as well as anyoen

Grunch · #3 08-16-2007, 05:29 PM

Skepticism is a trait of a winning poker player.

More often than not if I recall your posts, you were committed to putting all the chips in preflop not because you rated to be so far ahead of the opponents' ranges, but because pot odds required you to call.

Victor · #4 08-16-2007, 05:34 PM

i really want to believe and trust you guys but it seems that there is a fundamental flaw in stacking off with qq in the games i play.

whats a good sample size?

soon i will go thru the rest of my hands and look at every allin (even ones im not involved in.) i would be surprised if the data supported playing qq for 4bets.

Josh. · #5 08-16-2007, 05:34 PM

victor delete a pm

Victor · #6 08-16-2007, 05:38 PM

deleted josh.

diebitter · #7 08-16-2007, 05:53 PM

So, to be clear, you will get allin PF to a 4-bet with Queens?

4-bets PF means AA an awful lot of the time except at the smallest of micros and the nl400+ levels.

nichtsnutz · #8 08-16-2007, 06:03 PM

I actually have the same problem with KK at $10. I've lost so many preflop allins with it against AA (and KJ/AT a couple of times) that KK is an overall loser for me. It's only over 11K hands but still.

I just don't know when to fold it...

Grunch · #9 08-16-2007, 06:05 PM

[ QUOTE ]
So, to be clear, you will get allin PF to a 4-bet with Queens?

4-bets PF means AA an awful lot of the time except at the smallest of micros and the nl400+ levels.

[/ QUOTE ]

It's not that simple. Sometimes even when you're behind the opponent's range you still have to call. See the post I just bumped.

Grunch · #10 08-16-2007, 06:06 PM

[ QUOTE ]
I actually have the same problem with KK at $10. I've lost so many preflop allins with it against AA (and KJ/AT a couple of times) that KK is an overall loser for me. It's only over 11K hands but still.

I just don't know when to fold it...

[/ QUOTE ]

General rule of thumb: for 100 BBs, never fold KK preflop. The math just isn't there.