AQo in bb..c-bet flop, donk turn?

bennyhana · #1 09-02-2007, 11:16 AM

we've got an unknown open limper, a TAG overlimper,
button is loose and a little aggy(not very good is my note on him) overplays hands, sb is loose passive.

I'm not sure about my flop, or turn action. My reason for c-betting was if someone hit, most likely, they would overplay their hand enough I could make back the difference if I improve on the turn.

Full Tilt 2/4 Hold'em (9 handed) Hand History Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com (Format: 2+2 Forums)

Preflop: Hero is BB with A[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], Q[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img].
4 folds, MP3 calls, CO calls, Button calls, SB completes, Hero raises, MP3 calls, CO calls, Button calls, SB calls.

Flop: (11 SB) J[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], 3[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], K[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (5 players)
SB checks, Hero bets, MP3 calls, CO folds, Button raises, SB folds, Hero calls, MP3 calls.

Turn: (8.50 BB) A[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (3 players)
Hero bets, MP3 calls, Button calls.

River: (11.50 BB) 5[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (3 players)
Hero bets

NIX · #2 09-02-2007, 11:37 AM

I usually wouldn't c-bet that flop, although I don't really want to be blown off my over/gutshot if someone else bets at it and the agro Button raises.

My interpretation of your Button read makes me think he's raising AJ/AK/JJ/KK preflop, so the only hands he has that are ahead are A3/33/QT, and A3 seems out of line on the flop. So if you think you're ahead on the turn, and I think it's quite possible, how often do you think Button follows up on the turn? If it's a lot, I favor check/raising the turn.

Sushiglutton · #3 09-02-2007, 11:46 AM

I must admit I just check pf. Sure we have an edge, but playing AQo OOP agaisnt 4 opps is tough. But whatever I guess it's close either way.
The flop is more interesting.

[ QUOTE ]

I'm not sure about my flop, or turn action. My reason for c-betting was if someone hit, most likely, they would overplay their hand enough I could make back the difference if I improve on the turn.

[/ QUOTE ]

Do u mean a bet missrepresents your hand -> they will overplay? Anyway I think we should check. There are too many opps and I think it's better to just see what happens. If I understand correctly a few of them plays pretty aggro, so we are really risking beeing raised.

I think CR the turn is better. BTN is probably putting us on QQ, AQ, ATs. Since he is laggy he will most likely fire again. A CR protects our hand if MP3 has some kind of gut-shot draw, or low pair.

bozlax · #4 09-02-2007, 11:49 AM

Two aggros overlimp preflop, I'm not sure a raise is the best thing from the BB...I'd probably do it, I'm just not sure it's best, as it does put us in the position of having to c-bet regardless, and getting raised by a late-position player whose hand is hard to read...which is what happened.

Now I have to ask, why no c/r on the turn as played?

Maxinho · #5 09-02-2007, 12:19 PM

I check the PF, and check fold the flop
as played I c/c the flop and check call the turn and river against a agg player, and fold to a raise from the other player

Fadook · #6 09-02-2007, 01:06 PM

GRUNCH: I don't c-bet here for the standard reasons - too many players and you probably don't have the best hand. And with a decent draw you'd rather see the turn as cheaply as possible.
Against a guy like button I think I'll go for the c-r, though I don't think donking is horrible.

tyler_cracker · #7 09-02-2007, 02:17 PM

benny,

pf decision could go either way, flop could go either way, but i play it the same.

in particular i like the turn donk as it denies button a free card, traps mp, and prevents a button 3bet if we c/r.

CrMenace · #8 09-02-2007, 02:26 PM

[ QUOTE ]
My reason for c-betting was if someone hit, most likely, they would overplay their hand enough I could make back the difference if I improve on the turn.

[/ QUOTE ]

This logic seems a bit odd to me. Maybe it makes sense though.

Playing more traditionally, I wouldn't bet the flop since you are unlikely to still be ahead and you are unlikely to win it here. Also, I don't think folding anyone out will improve your winning chances based on this board. That is, if anyone would fold which because of the pot size is unlikely.

I like the turn donk as it gets the most in the pot (edit: meaning it traps mp). You are most likely ahead since no-one raised PF.

neurotiq · #9 09-02-2007, 03:13 PM

I wouldn't c-bet this flop. Four villains on that board means that somebody hit. Note that you do have a gutshot and an overcard, though, so if there isn't a lot of raising and you have the odds, by all means, continue. [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

I like the turn donk. Nicely played. [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]