Play a Hand With the Masters #3 Flop

[Firefly]

1) A lot of people talk about playing tight early and don't try to steal blinds when they are this small. What do you think about blind stealing at this level? Would you do it and if so under what conditions?

I like the pf raise because we are really deep and most players in this tournament aren't great postflop players. People love to defend their BB and we can win a big pot if we hit big. Sometimes i'll raise stuff like T9s early if i feel that it could lead to a big pot. Not a standard play but if the table conditions are right, i'll go for it.

2) What's your decision on the flop? Do you check or bet (and if so, how much)?
Weee. Good flop, bet 100.


3)I think i'm betting just about every turn card if villan checks to me excepting a 6 [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] or an 8 [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] which i would check behind.

[adanthar]

I don't raise much with these types of hands early, but I'll occasionally open limp with them to play these same pots. I agree that it's just a style thing.

On this flop, I want to bet 80-100, call a raise and pop most turns.

[SossMan]

The reason that you can raise here preflop w/ stacks this deep isn't to steal the blinds. It's to have a chance at stacking someone (and there are plenty of these players) who flops top pair and wants to go to war w/ it. You have position and all the implied odds. You are very rarely going to get a bunch of money in bad whereas your opponent certainly has that potential. And if you steal the blinds, so be it, you had 7 high.

Personally, I might limp there, but raising to 3x is good too, since it will often get you 4 free cards if you want them.

My plan is to bet out this flop and hope that BB caught a piece or wants to semi bluff. There is no reason to feel that we are behind at this point, so the trick is maximizing the money that gets in while were ahead. Our hand is pretty vulnerable to turn/river cards that either kill action or make us a second best hand, so I want to get some money in the pot asap.

Stacks are still deep enough that I don't really worry about a plan for a specific turn card until I get to that point. It's not like either of us are committing ourselves to the hand by betting/raising a certain amount on the flop anyway.

Bet 2/3 - 3/4 pot.

[Eaglesfan1]

Solid.

[Rduke55]

[ QUOTE ]

Pre-Flop and Flop Questions

1) A lot of people talk about playing tight early and don't try to steal blinds when they are this small. What do you think about blind stealing at this level? Would you do it and if so under what conditions?

2) What's your decision on the flop? Do you check or bet (and if so, how much)?

3) What's your plan on the turn (if any) based on your decision on the flop, the villain's action, and what card comes?

4) Any other thoughts at this point?

[/ QUOTE ]

I like the raise. As MLG said, we're not neccessarily stealing here. I think that people that don't start raising in the early levels for the reason of "not worth stealing" are making a huge mistake. Besides the metagame considerations (ooh, first time I used that phrase) you can build decent pots against presumably weaker players that haven't had a chance to get busted yet.

I bet 1/2-2/3 pot on the flop because I'd often c-bet even if I whiffed. A free card here is terrible. He's coming along with any decent draw and top pair/overpair.

On the turn my action on any heart, str8 card, or 9 depends on his bet. If he called my flop bet I'm more woriied baout a 9 than a heart so I may bet out a heart to get a cheap showdown if it's not too scary.

Thoughts are that right now I'm willing to play a big pot. If the turn isn't too scary I may try and take it down there.

[Grunch]

I'd like to toss my naive hat in to this ring.

In general, regarding blinds-stealing early. I'll definitely try to steal blinds in the early stages. For one thing, I'd prefer to have a LAG image early and a TAG image late, and early blind-stealing helps a lot. The reason for this is becasue I want my big hands paid off early and I don't play as many hands as my opponents thing. And later, when the blinds are much bigger compared to stacks, I want my steals respected.

So I'd raise this preflop, but in this case it's not 100% a steal raise. I want to play this hand first of all, becasue it can flop very big and I feel I can outplay my opponents often enough, especially in position. Second, since it was checked around to me, I'm opening for a raise any hand I intend to play. This helps my loose-aggressive image whereas open-limping hurts it. Plus, given that I'm on the button I'd very often raise this even if there were many limpers ahead of me.

On the flop, I bet my usual bet, around 2/3-3/4 PSB.If it were multiway, I'd bet a full pot. I bet for two reasons. First, and way more important, I bet for value.

Second, I bet to protect. The board is drawy, and I'm concerned about that. I'm less concerned becasue it's heads-up, but I'm still concerned and I feel compelled to charge draws. I feel that this is one of the weakest parts of my game currently. Why should I be so worried in a heads-up pot about being up against hearts? I'd like to be able to develop my game to the point where I'd be willing to check this flop if I felt that the best way to win the most or lose the least. But I'm not there yet.

On the turn, I'm planning to bet if checked to no matter what comes. I can find a fold if raised. Other than that it's hard to generalize. I'd like to see what comes.

[Hotrod0823]

1) Given the deepish stacks and the longer levels I see no reason not to raise this PF. Easy enough to get away from if RR and pretty easy to get away from if you miss the flop. Winning the blinds uncontested is a possiblity as well. With this hand your hand is well hidden. It can look like many things given position, reads and player history. I like the PF raise.

2) With bottom 2 on this board I like to bet it. I'd bet around the pot say 150. It is a draw heavy board with straight and flush possiblities but I think the BB's range is Axs or better here. With 150 I can still charge the draws to play and get away if BB pushes on me. Will bet and fold if RR allin. May call a small RR.

3) If the turn is a blank I am prepared to put out a 2/3 pot bet. I may bet out 1/2 pot or so if checked too if a flush/straight card comes or call a smallish 1/2 pot bet or less. I don't want to give any free cards here.

4) I am willing to play a bit on this flop but will be cautious if the turn card is scary.

Hotrod

[ghato]

1) I dont like raising to just steal the blinds at this level. But raising in this spot doesnt seem to be about stealing 30chips. Seems more designed to build the pot when Hero seems to have an edge (disguised hand with potential/position/great implied odds). I like it. Most of the time the BB will fold to a cbet anyway.

2) Bet 90 (its what I would bet as a cbet), call a check raise (unless villian is crazy enough to jam at this point which I strongly doubt).

3) Im goin to play this hand strong unless I see the 8 [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] or 6 [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img].

4) A 5 or a 7 on the turn would be nice, unless he has 99 (muahahahaha)...

[jon_1van]

1) What do you think about blind stealing at this level? Would you do it and if so under what conditions?

I think this is fine. You aren't really stealing blinds. The bigger point of this hand is to get called. And play a hand when your opponent will be reluctant to put you on this particular hand. And because its deep you can afford to lose the inital bet if you are raised.

2) What's your decision on the flop? Do you check or bet (and if so, how much)?

I think you don't really have a choice but to bet here. It would look really wierd to check here. A cautious opponent might give you alot less action with a hand like 89 or A9 if you casually ignore this highly coordinated board. Also, you don't hate winning now, as the turn could get ugly.

I bet 100.

3) What's your plan on the turn (if any) based on your decision on the flop, the villain's action, and what card comes?

Ideally I'll have an oppurtunity to check behind. Given the oppurtinity I will do so, on any turn card.
I realize that there are some turn cards that most would bet. But I feel the value of "giving up" with your "over cards" thus inducing more action from a 89 type hand later, and the value of keeping the pot small is enough to warrent value betting.

I'd probably fold to a potish bet given an 6/8 [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] turn. I'd call a potish bet from most other cards. I would hope that calling the turn bet given a "touchy" turn card would prompt the opponent to check to me on the river. I'd prefer not to call to pot size bets.

4) Any other thoughts at this point?

I really want to play a small pot.

[McMelchior]

Without reading other's replies:
[ QUOTE ]
1) A lot of people talk about playing tight early and don't try to steal blinds when they are this small. What do you think about blind stealing at this level? Would you do it and if so under what conditions?


[/ QUOTE ] I like this play a lot - especially with the higher starting stacks. Without this kind of moves, I'm basically doomed to sit and wait for a prime hand, and even when I get it there's a big risk I might have to fold on the flop or the turn if the action implies somebody stayed in with a "unusual" hand and hit the board.

The very big advantage of raising here is, that it's basically impossible for opponents to put Strassa on a hand (at least early in the hand), whereas he will have a better chance of predicting what type of hands will call his raise.

It would be nice to have some kind of read on Villian, but in lack of that Strassa's possibly facing a low to medium pair (might even include JJ), two high cards or marginally suited connectors down to 87s.

Bottom two pair is not my favorite - a somewhat vulnerable holding, that must be protected. If I knew Villian to be aggressive I'd clearly check, hoping for an opportunity to put in a substantial CR and end the hand with a nice profit here.

But shy of any reads I'm betting the pot or close to the pot - t150.

If Villian raises I'm gleefully three-betting - big. Let there be no doubt I have the goods. OK, if he then pushes I'll have to be concerned about a set, though it's not that likely since I have two of the cards he'd need to make one. Again reads would be extremely valuable here. There'll always be a good chance of a slow-played overpair, especially in an online tournament with lots of low-buy-in satellite qualifiers in it.

If Villian flat calls the most concerning turn would (of course) be the flush card. Marginally an off-suit 8 (or even a 6), depending on how donkish I can imagine him to be. If one of those cards fall I'd probably put in a bet around 2/3 of the pot, and slow down substantially if I get a call or a raise.

Optimal cards course be and non-heart 2, 3, 4, 5 or 7. I would feel very confident and mainly worry about getting the most chips out of Villian.

Non-heart T or J could raise some concern, and I'd proceed steady but with care. Q, K or Ace would open the possibility that he hit one of his high cards and would be willing to commit substantial amounts of chips (though Ace would give the risk of being up against a higher two pair and lead to caution on my part).

Nice hand - thanks Lloyd (and Strassa).

Best,

McMelchior (Johan)