.15/.30 - low pair versus two aces on flop

[Mitke]

[ QUOTE ]
Turn: Made your FH but a likely A has us crushed with 2nd FH. I call BB reraise.

River: I just call down.

[/ QUOTE ]

This seems very weak IMO.

AA is 1 combo
A4 is 2 combos
A2 is 6 combos
A6 is 6 combos
66 is 3 combos

= 18 combos


22 is 3 combos
53 is 16 combos


A9 is 8 combos (I assume Villain raises other aces)
A8 is 8 combos
A7 is 8 combos
A5 is 8 combos
A3 is 8 combos

= 59

(plus other pocket pairs he could be getting out of line with)

Just get as many bets in as you can with your full house here.

[KaatzMeow]

Kit,

My AF for the flop is 2.50.

I like to know where I stand with 2nd or 3rd pair but honestly I would not put myself in this position with this hand so this is how I would play it but I am not in this position very often if at all...

By exploitable you mean that Villains would just let me bet their hands for them? If so, that has happened to me a few times...hehe

[KaatzMeow]

Oops, I misread the HH...I thought the 4 put a second pair on the board...sorry

Turn & River are good.

[KitCloudkicker]

[ QUOTE ]
Kit,

My AF for the flop is 2.50.

I like to know where I stand with 2nd or 3rd pair but honestly I would not put myself in this position with this hand so this is how I would play it but I am not in this position very often if at all...

By exploitable you mean that Villains would just let me bet their hands for them? If so, that has happened to me a few times...hehe

[/ QUOTE ]

by exploitable, i mean that for observant opponents, if you raise/fold the flop frequently, your opponents' 3 betting range will increase substantially. you will also lose value from opponents folding to your raise when they will often barrel all 3 streets (drawing very thin) if you play your hand passively.

its been said on this forum time and time again but its worth repeating. dont raise for information. the information you get is unreliable and you usually dont use it anyway. raising to "find out where you stand" is almost always bad poker.

[KaatzMeow]

Kit,

Flopping 2nd or 3rd pair has been a difficult area for me. Trying to apply the "proper" mix of aggression and passive play has been a struggle with me opting for more aggression rather than just calling behind.

I brings to mind a post by Ozzie or BBB which showed a graph that plunged when he read SSHE but misapplied the concepts. Again, trying to find the right mix of aggression and passive play is the goal. I have just started to do some level 2 thinking, i.e. thinking what the Villain may hold in his hand which results in MUBS thinking too.

[Huggs]

Grunch:

PF:
Either raise or fold. I typically fold small pairs and definitely do not open limp from MP2 with small pairs as you prefer multi-way action with this type of hand. If I do enter, it is for a raise.

Are you implying loose, passive with “passive”? You have seen multiple hands with multiple people who are on the button or 2-3 off it just limping? If so, you may be justified here in calling.

F:
Either raise or fold – I do not like calling it this spot. If you think you are ahead, you want to be protecting your equity in the pot and charging him bets. If you think you are behind, you want to be folding as the pot contains 2.5 SB and you have two outs.

Additionally, you have shown weakness limping in from a late-middle position, so he can be leading here with a wide range.

T:
Fine as played

R:
Fine as played. If he re-pops it, I just call.

[JamesAt15]

I didn't have a good feel if the table was loose or tight overall. By "passive" I meant that I felt that if I limped, it was likely the players after would limp or call, not raise.

Agreed with all the "raise or fold" comments on both pre-flop and flop.

I posted this because I thought the idea of the implied odds after the flop was interesting, since if the BB has an ace and Hero hits the 4 on the turn, you can get in a lot of big bets (as happened here). After a bit more thought, it feels more like wishful thinking justifying a poor play with a good result.

Edit: actually, with that in mind, if you raise the flop and he re-raises, do you fold or call?

Cheers all.

[TimovieMan]

[ QUOTE ]
Edit: actually, with that in mind, if you raise the flop and he re-raises, do you fold or call?

[/ QUOTE ]

Imho, if you raise the flop, and he re-raises, then you have to fold. His stats don’t look all that aggressive, so unless you have a clear read saying he’ll bluff a paired board, you have to assume he has an ace or medium pocket pair.

However you have to take into account that your openlimping from middle position didn’t really indicate you have a strong hand, so he could be well convinced that you don’t hold an ace, and even hitting the 2 could have him believe he has the better hand…
But this is metagame play that doesn’t really apply to .15/.30 opponents…

[calidris]

I might be weak/tight but for 2.5 SB I fold flop and move on to the next hand.