how bad is this play vs THEWachovia

[drzen]

I hate it when donkeys make terrible calls and then make out they are Phil Hellmuth's better-playing brother. NH.

[nath]

flop and stack sizes are great to bet-3-bet

[NHFunkii]

[ QUOTE ]
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yea i have no idea how AQ called here.

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because the giant all in overbet screamed "draw"

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it also screamed "MEDIUM TO STRONG (tptk, two pair, set) BUT VULNERABLE HAND WITH WHICH I WANT TO CHARGE YOU TO DRAW AGAINST"

seriously AQ is an ugly call there I think

[pulse]

Thread title should be how bad is this call by THEWachovia. Your line is okay. Bet, 3 bet AI is best. Or checkraise 4x his bet, get it in on any turn. If he is indeed a thinking player the 3-4x raise looks stronger most of the time.

[registrar]

[ QUOTE ]
Thread title should be how bad is this call by THEWachovia. Your line is okay. Bet, 3 bet AI is best. Or checkraise 4x his bet, get it in on any turn. If he is indeed a thinking player the 3-4x raise looks stronger most of the time.

[/ QUOTE ]

Villain played badly in the hand but I don't hate his call. I hate the min-raise UTG with AQo into equal stacks in the big blinds. I sometimes min-raise UTG but the conditions don't seem right here. However, if he has reason to think that a min-raise UTG will get respect and fold to the blinds, one of who will call for value and then fold on the flop, the play is perhaps justifiable.

As for the call, he's prbably right to assume that hero is either stop and going or is pushing a draw. He's not to know the draw is such a monster. Again, we cannot judge his play without knowing his reads on hero but I suspect that, if the hand was posted the other way round, many posters here would say that, given our equity and after assigning a range to BB doing this, and our broadway draw, this is a call.

I suspect hero has more FE with a raise and then a push though. However, the disadvantage with that line is that I think villain generally pushes, if anything and calling off your stack with the royal draw is a lot less sexy than pushing in with it.

[psyduck]

AQ is a horrible call here.

I would c/r (YOU HAVE A [censored] ROYAL DRAW) or bet/3-bet. I lean towards b/3-b just because this moran minraised pf.

NICE CALL THERE AQ. WORLD CLASS CHAMP.

[Foucault]

I'm surprised so many people are advocating a three-bet all in here. I agree stack sizes are good for it, but I would think a good player (never played with Wachovia, so I don't know whether he fits this description) with a one-pair hand would just call a flop lead on a board this scary in position. A c/r definitely gives us a better chance of getting it all in on the flop, relative to a lead.

[m1illion]

[ QUOTE ]
THEWachovia, a player whom I respect, berated my play on this hand after he busted me. Opinions?




***** Hand History for Game 5074655514 *****
0/0 Tourney Texas Hold'em Game Table (NL) (Tournament 28126397) - Thu Aug 31 22:32:38 EDT 2006
Table Super Thursday(817195) Table 20 (Real Money) -- Seat 9 is the button
Total number of players : 10
Seat 1: BOATNOGOOD (9122)
Seat 2: THEWachovia (9248)
Seat 3: Jiksta (15365)
Seat 4: Inspecta_Deck (8394)
Seat 5: LarryDavid55 (5608)
Seat 6: Sugar_D (4258)
Seat 7: nickybabing (25038)
Seat 8: Follldit (6907)
Seat 9: ROCKYBOYY (4173)
Seat 10: davidross (10546)
davidross posts small blind (150)
BOATNOGOOD posts big blind (300)
** Dealing down cards **
Dealt to BOATNOGOOD [ Ah, Th ]
THEWachovia raises (600) to 600
Jiksta folds.
Inspecta_Deck folds.
LarryDavid55 folds.
Sugar_D folds.
nickybabing folds.
Follldit folds.
ROCKYBOYY folds.
davidross folds.
BOATNOGOOD calls (300)
** Dealing Flop ** : [ Qh, Kh, Ts ]
BOATNOGOOD checks.
THEWachovia bets (900)
BOATNOGOOD raises (8522) to 8522
BOATNOGOOD is all-In.
THEWachovia calls (7622)
** Dealing Turn ** : [ 3s ]
** Dealing River ** : [ 4d ]
Creating Main Pot with $18394 with BOATNOGOOD
** Summary **
Main Pot: 18394 |
Board: [ Qh Kh Ts 3s 4d ]

BOATNOGOOD balance 0, lost 9122 [ Ah Th ] [ a pair of tens -- Ah,Kh,Qh,Th,Ts ]
THEWachovia balance 18520, bet 9122, collected 18394, net +9272 [ As Qd ] [ a pair of queens -- As,Kh,Qd,Qh,Ts ]

[/ QUOTE ]

1,712,304 games 0.078 secs 21,952,615 games/sec

Board:
Dead:

equity (%) win (%) tie (%)
Hand 1: 31.0107 % 28.27% 02.74% { AhTh }
Hand 2: 68.9893 % 66.25% 02.74% { AsQd }


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990 games 0.005 secs 198,000 games/sec

Board: Qh Kh Ts
Dead:

equity (%) win (%) tie (%)
Hand 1: 47.7778 % 42.32% 05.45% { AhTh }
Hand 2: 52.2222 % 46.77% 05.45% { AsQd }


---

You lost a post flop coin flip. Should you be berated? No.
If he puts you on a draw and feels like coin flipping with the weight on his end, that his decision.
I don't like either the shove or the call.

[mic_check12]

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flop and stack sizes are great to bet-3-bet

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[registrar]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
flop and stack sizes are great to bet-3-bet

[/ QUOTE ]

[/ QUOTE ]

How many of the holdings in villain's range here are going to bite and raise? I think villain pushes or calls if we lead and that sucks.