Don't EVER transfer money on PokerStars, don't even send first

raze · #1 10-10-2007, 04:14 PM

'ArnieF' asks me for $1,020 Party for $1,120 Stars, he sends first. I say sure, what's the harm if he's going to send first.

He sends $100, I send $100 back. He sends the rest, I send the rest. Fine. The next day (today), I get this:

Hello Aaron,

It has come to our attention that on 10/9/07 you received a total of $1120
from 'voippoker200' with whom we have an outstanding matter with. We would
appreciate if you could explain your relation to 'voippoker200' and the
reason for the transfer you received from him.

Pending your reply, your account has been deactivated.

Kind regards,

Adriana
PokerStars Security

After more back-and-forth, Stars makes it clear that this guy deposited via some kind of credit card fraud, and now they're just going to keep the balance he sent me.

I haven't heard of this happening before. Am I stupid to trust the discretion of Poker Stars approval on player transfers? If they're accusing this guy of fraud, why the hell is he allowed to make player transfers?

This means anybody can make an illegal deposit, and then transfer the money out, even SENDING FIRST, and then the host site will chase down whoever was doing the transfer with this guy.

They approved his sending money to me, so how the [censored] is this my fault?

cardman · #2 10-10-2007, 04:29 PM

Wow, even being sent first on Stars isn't safe.

Henry17 · #3 10-10-2007, 04:32 PM

I don't like to use fault but you did (although with no knowledge) help someone commit fraud. It sucks but in essence Stars has no way of knowing if you were in on it with the guy or not.

[Phill] · #4 10-10-2007, 04:34 PM

As far as im aware this is the case on just about every site and its the one reason i dont do all this transfer stuff.

raze · #5 10-10-2007, 04:38 PM

[ QUOTE ]
I don't like to use fault but you did (although with no knowledge) help someone commit fraud.

[/ QUOTE ]

Fair enough, but if this guy is under investigation, why is he permitted to transfer out his illicit balance in the first place? If they would lock down his account transfers along with standard cash-out options (assuming they did so), this BS wouldn't even be possible, and because of this, I feel Stars is a lot more responsible for this incident than I am.

RedRover · #6 10-10-2007, 04:38 PM

It's been like this forever on every site

Henry17 · #7 10-10-2007, 04:51 PM

[ QUOTE ]
Fair enough, but if this guy is under investigation, why is he permitted to transfer out his illicit balance in the first place? If they would lock down his account transfers along with standard cash-out options (assuming they did so), this BS wouldn't even be possible, and because of this, I feel Stars is a lot more responsible for this incident than I am.

[/ QUOTE ]

Because when the transfer was made they had no idea about the fraud yet. It takes time for the charge-backs to show up or for the e-check to bounce. The scam artist basically has 3 to 25-30 days depending on what service they are defrauding to find someone to make a trade with.

Before the scamer would have a second account and just withdrawal the money but sites got better at detecting that so now they need to find someone to trade with.

Was the trade initiated on here? I'd explain the situation to Stars. Get documentation from Party. Show them the chat on an independent site where you met this lowlife etc.

jkpoker · #8 10-10-2007, 04:57 PM

I dont understand why people risk this. with the new payment processors there is no need.... epass works great between stars ap and FT.

If someone has money on party they have access to way better methods.

sorry bud

KittyLiquor · #9 10-10-2007, 05:46 PM

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Fair enough, but if this guy is under investigation, why is he permitted to transfer out his illicit balance in the first place? If they would lock down his account transfers along with standard cash-out options (assuming they did so), this BS wouldn't even be possible, and because of this, I feel Stars is a lot more responsible for this incident than I am.

[/ QUOTE ]

Because when the transfer was made they had no idea about the fraud yet. It takes time for the charge-backs to show up or for the e-check to bounce. The scam artist basically has 3 to 25-30 days depending on what service they are defrauding to find someone to make a trade with.

Before the scamer would have a second account and just withdrawal the money but sites got better at detecting that so now they need to find someone to trade with.

Was the trade initiated on here? I'd explain the situation to Stars. Get documentation from Party. Show them the chat on an independent site where you met this lowlife etc.

[/ QUOTE ]

Also... They wouldn't let him "cashout," just play the money. You let him "cashout" sorta.

HEY POKERSTARS, why won't you let him cashout, but you WILL let him transfer???? I don't think you should let a player tranfer uncertified funds. It should be the same policy as a cashout. It would stop some of this kind of stuff immediately.

JMHO

-------------Kitty

ALLEN BOND · #10 10-10-2007, 05:50 PM

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Fair enough, but if this guy is under investigation, why is he permitted to transfer out his illicit balance in the first place? If they would lock down his account transfers along with standard cash-out options (assuming they did so), this BS wouldn't even be possible, and because of this, I feel Stars is a lot more responsible for this incident than I am.

[/ QUOTE ]

Because when the transfer was made they had no idea about the fraud yet. It takes time for the charge-backs to show up or for the e-check to bounce. The scam artist basically has 3 to 25-30 days depending on what service they are defrauding to find someone to make a trade with.

Before the scamer would have a second account and just withdrawal the money but sites got better at detecting that so now they need to find someone to trade with.

Was the trade initiated on here? I'd explain the situation to Stars. Get documentation from Party. Show them the chat on an independent site where you met this lowlife etc.

[/ QUOTE ]

Also... They wouldn't let him "cashout," just play the money. You let him "cashout" sorta.

HEY POKERSTARS, why won't you let him cashout, but you WILL let him transfer???? I don't think you should let a player tranfer uncertified funds. It should be the same policy as a cashout. It would stop some of this kind of stuff immediately.

JMHO

-------------Kitty

[/ QUOTE ]

Exactly! Make the [censored] policy just like deposit policy. You cannot cash out a deposit for 48 hours, make transfers disabled for 10 days after deposit via a speculative method.

It will solve MOST transfer fraud.