Taking down the pot early

[finalboarder]

Hi, i just started playing 2NL Hold'em recently. I have been reading stickies in the PL/NL Texas Hold'em Micro Stakes section to improve my game. I have been winning profit (small profit as it is) with my current game, in which I usually take down the pot usually on the flop or turn. This includes when I'm bluffing and when I actually have a hand.

I recently tried to change my game by trying to extract more value when I have a hand. However this has been backfiring for me. An example hand when I have KAs. Flop comes up K74 rainbow. With hands like top-pair it seems that more often than not if I do not take it down on the flop I get outdrawn. Even on the flops that look draw-less.

So my question is, is it better to take down pots earlier when you have hands like TPTK? And just wait for 2-pair, sets, trips, and better to go further?

[JH1]

I try to stick to what you were doing before - taking down the pot early with TP/TK. The only action you are going to get on the hand you gave as an example is a hand that beats you (a set). So winning a small pot is all you can hope for in that situation.

If I remember correctly, I believe that 2 pair is the average winning hand, so TP/TK is still relatively weak if you are in a large pot, so try to take those pots down early before they get too big.

Going broke with TP/TK used to be a huge problem for me but you just have to stop and think about what your opponent would be raising or calling you with in each situation.

Edit: I should add that if they are calling and your read is that they are on a draw, then by all means get as much value out of them as you can. You are not making a mistake as long as you don't pay off Villain when he does hit his draw.

[shaftman11]

The other great thing about playing micro stakes is that people tend to play no fold'em hold'em. That and the range of hands they will start with is wicked crazy. Having somebody call your pre-flop raise w 7-2 suited is not uncommon (ob they call cuz the cards are suited). The other thing is they will call w a face card and won't lay down a hand when the catch any part of it, or they have a gut shot, or need runner runner for the straight or the flush.

BTW. 2 pair is the "average" winning hand in hold'em, so TPTK isn't always the greatest hand in the world.

Anyway,

Good Luck!

[Greg Miller]

[ QUOTE ]

Edit: I should add that if they are calling and your read is that they are on a draw, then by all means get as much value out of them as you can. You are not making a mistake as long as you don't pay off Villain when he does hit his draw.

[/ QUOTE ]

The other approach is to commit to paying them off when they hit. Raise enough to cut down their implied odds enough to make chasing unprofitable even if you call an all-in every time they hit their draw.

The ideal is not to get people to fold worse hands. The ideal is to price them out and have them *still* call your bet. That's where you make the most money, even though you'll get sucked out on sometimes.

(Limit, of course, is a different story. Most of the time, you'd bet/fold, or call all the way with top pair--details depending on how your opponent plays and how often he'd raise with a hand that can't beat one pair).

[SaErDnaW]

Say you raise preflop with AK. You get one or two callers and the flop comes K74 rainbow. You bet say a 2/3 to a full pot. Both calls.

Why did the villains called the preflop raise in the first place? Do they call every raise or only when they have something good?

Why did they call you on the flop? Do you almost always c-bet on the flop or do you only bet when you hit something?

What type of hands would the villains call the flop bet with? Would they raise with two pair or more, would they raise a draw? Would they fold if they have less than any of the above? Would they call down to the river with any two cards?

How big are the stacks?

What do they think you have, based on this play and earlier hands?

How are you going to continue on the turn and river when something that completes a draw comes. When a blank comes?

This things and much, much more should be constantly going through your mind every single hand you play.

It's not easy, but you really have to think about what you and the other players are doing and act accordingly. Then you have to decide if you are going to fold, call or raise. And if you decide to bet: bet the amount that accomplishes your goal for the given hand. No more, no less.



I am tired so I write way too much instead of trying to answer your question in a simple way :-)


Don't fall in love with your two cards! In my experience TPTK and similar hands, shouldn't be played as the nuts. I have lost a LOT of money on those hands, before I realized that people very rarely make big raises against the preflop raiser(me) on a board where it's obvious that I have TPTK or maybe even an overpair. If I meet too much resistance with a TPTK-kind of hand without much additional outs, and I have no specific reads that tells me that the villain is a complete idiot, I'll try to get out and wait for a better situation. This have saved me a lot of money.

I am hoping that anything of this can be to your help. I am going to bed now... ZZZZzzzZZZZZ