Sniper - reborn?

[Sniper]

There has been a significant amount of discussion going on over the last week, into determining what is an appropriate level of participation for me going forward. Several proposals were bantered around between various Mods/Admins before these things were brought to me. Mat made contact with me on Thursday, and I started communicating with Ryan directly again on Friday. I was busy with preplanned activities with my kids over the weekend, or I would have posted these things over the weekend.

There has been a tremendous amount of pressure put on me at this point, to simply start posting in the Mod forum again. ElD even contacted me last night, which was both unexpected and appreciated.

I hope that we can all find a way to move forward from this, and apologize for my not being able to fully and actively participate in the discussions two weekends ago.

That said, I am interested in broad mod opinion on how to best proceed from here. I will put up one of the proposals for discussion in my next post, and follow up with some of the thoughts I have conveyed to others over the last few days as soon as I can edit them for appropriateness to post here. It should also be known that I have asked Ryan to reconsider his decision and full reinstate me as Mod of my 3 forums, so I can demonstrate that I have heard what you guys have been saying and intend to modify my behaviour in the Mod forum based on your comments.

So, here's where I am at:
1. I am fighting for a full reinstatement
2. Alternatively, I am willing to find a middle ground solution that is acceptable to the Mods/Admins
3. I have shared and will continue to share thoughts on mod additions
4. I am willing to discuss the issues raised 2 weekends ago, if thats what you want
5. I am hopeful that you guys will be willing to give me another chance, and that my willingness to listen to other Mods & stay out of Modwars, added to my positive contributions in other areas, will lead to an agreement that full reinstatement is the right way to go.

Can we all move forward as a team with a reborn Sniper, who has learned much from this experience, and that continues to positively contribute, but is less irritating?

More post to follow...

[[censored]]

Sniper,

I don't in anyway mean this to be rude or hostile by my opinion is that you should be returned to regular poster status, stop posting in the mod forum and never be a mod again.

[Sniper]

1. In lengthy discussions with many people over the past few days, (and after a lot of soul-searching), it has been proposed that I be allowed to keep my limited Moderator status with the following responsibilities:

a) I will continue my active role in the UBB7 upgrade. In this role I will continue as temporary Admin on the test server. I have done a lot of work there, and there is no reason for that to stop.

b) I will continue to work with Chuck to provide any assistance required to ensure that the archive servers and the archiving process is working properly. I am told that my catch on the 800,000 missing archive posts and my subsequent work with Chuck to resolve this problem was appreciated. Chuck may ask for my assistance as he deems appropriate.

c) I will assist TwoPlusTwo by continuing to provide relevant statistical facts in conversations in the Mod forum. Since my self-imposed exile, I have not responded in the Mod forum. I believe this shows that I will be able to restrain myself from expressing my opinions in the Mod forum, and that I can disengage from any future "ModWars". I will be able to provide factual stats and commentary without expressing unwanted opinions in the Mod forum.

2. I will continue with informal information support work with Pokeraddict in A/R, Berge in Legislation, Mike and Jim in ATF/Zoo, and Carter in TLDR. My participation there with those Mods, based on their comments, is appreciated. This will include my continuing to answer user questions and provide stats in ATF, my continued support of my high traffic Site Tracking & Neteller threads in Legislation, etc. The respective Mods can work out the details with me.

3. I will be undertitled "Forum Statsman" and I will be given a color change tbd.

4. I also have been give the opportunity to respond to the latest criticisms about past matters, if you guys still want to hear from me in this respect.

[Sniper]

On Thursday, Mat asked me some questions, and essentially asked me to get angry and stream my thoughts to him. This is an excerpt of some of the things that I said (also, in one paragraph names removed to protect the innocent).

Streaming...

Mat, I'm not "Angry" at you... you're the boss... you have to make the tough decisions.... and I support your decisions whatever they are. All I have ever tried to do was help in ways that I thought were helpful. And, I will continue to help in whatever ways I can. I sent off another email to Chuck on finishing off the last bits of the archive issue today. I am disappointed that we couldn't stick to what we agreed... to me, Exile = Punishment that fits the crime. Removed from Mod of 3 Forums I've worked hard to build up, for reasons not related to my modding of those forums = punishment does not fit the crime.

If I were you, the second [censored] posted up his list, I would have reversed everything and put an end to ModWars for good. But I am not you! Modwars has been going on for a long time, and there has been no attempt to stop it. There are 3 main factions in the Mod forum... the Blackhats, the CSP, and the Silent Majority who just want to quietly do their modding and don't even read the mod forum that much. In the CSP, DB and I are the most vocal and therefore we take the most heat. Is not having that balance of opinions good... that is for you to decide. By accepting/choosing exile, I accepted your decision on that. And I believe DB has also come to the same decision with changing his name and trying to get a fresh start that way.

PA and morgant both respect my opinions on matters related to RB providers, because I am actively engaged in that forum and in talking to them, tracking down rogues and gimmick accounts, and keeping tabs on what these guys are doing outside A/R. At one point, morgant was talking about adding me as a Player Representative Mod to A/R when he was sponsoring it, just to help alleviate the issue of any bias on his part. Tracking down douchebags on 2+2 is one of the things I do well (you might want to reread PA's lengthy post when he got back from live play this weekend. Part of the delay here was in not being able to talk to him because he simply wasn't around... I was not taking any action on Degen until I talked to him, it's his realm and I respect him too much to do that)

As to Degen, he is a scumbag, douchebag, total idiot... whatever label you want to use, and I have been telling him that for a long time. Despite appearances that I have simply been defending him. What I have been trying to do is rehabilitate him, so that he wouldn't do stupid [censored] to get him rogued or piss off other mods in other forums he participates in. He is not the only poster from my forums that causes trouble elsewhere, and he is not the only poster I've tried to help. [Apparently my posters should be helped rather than banned philosophy is wrong... ] Unfortunately, Degen has not listened to my advice. One of my last posts in Mod was saying that Falang = Degen, this has been clear for a long time.

I think I covered your main question in my response in Mod to Nation, but just to reinforce... He talks to a whole group of moderators on a regular basis. He may even be providing some of them their Rakeback. He knew some of the stuff that was going on in the Mod forum, even before I did. I have not provided him access to Mod, nor shared any information about what people have said about him. I have never met him, all I know about him personally is what I've read. He was simply a good poster in my forums that I have tried and failed repeatedly to get to change his ways.

If coming out of my earlier conversations with PA and morgant, they both strongly believed that he should be rogued and didn't warrant some attention to try and straighten him out, I never would have defended him for so long. It's not like I paid these guys off to not ban degen. In all the threads, you can see that it was always their decision, barring the initial unbanning without talking to anyone first (and the rules/situation around unbanning were very different a year ago...it was more frequently done... and in fact, I am not the only Mod to ever unban Degen w/o consultation)

XXX tells me not to post anything, XXX tells me you want me to post, I thought I was running everything by you and doing what you wanted, Ryan posted that he doesn't like the way I handled the situation... If I can't trust what you and XXX tell me, what am I supposed to do?

Somewhere along the line, it was forgotten that Mods do other things aside from read 2+2 all day... if there is any injustice in this, it is that when confronted with a situation where I was being told that I didn't give things enough thought last year, I end up getting clobbered for actually taking the time to do a thoughtful review, analysis, and soul searching NOW... that sucks!

[NT!]

sniper,

not trying to be mean or cruel here, but i think most mods are totally ready to never think about your modding again. all that other stuff you want to do is fine, have fun. maybe if you took the time to post half this much stuff back when we were actually discussing it people would be interested in reading it; as is, TL;DR

[Sniper]

These thoughts are a little more disjointed, as they were originally focused on responding to comments from Ryan, but I think they are worth sharing (among other things, quoted Ryan statements removed)...




My contributions weren't the issue, and were clearly dismissed by those with another agenda. I predicted the results of the Final poll in Mod. It cuts clearly across Blackhat vs CSP lines, with the silent majority (60-70 of the roughly 100 with mod access, not even voting no opinion).

If you followed the threads in Mod closely, you would know, that I have the support of ALL the primary Mods in forums where I actively post (and I work closely with those Mods). I do not have the support of those with another agenda, who neither actively participate in my forums, or the other forums I actively post in. I am not a child of OOT... The forums have gotten too large for anyone to know what is going on across ALL the forums... In my post count thread and other posts in ATF, I try to close that gap in knowledge.

I post on 2+2 when I have time, sometimes I have more time than others, sometimes I merely respond to PMs and put up some quick posts, other times I stream out a lot of traffic generating posts. A couple of week/ends ago, and even moreso this weekend, I didn't have much time and my time on 2+2 was minimized. I was hung, without having an appropriate amount of time to defend myself, against a rehashing of year old issues. And when I took the time to reread and give thoughtful consideration to the old stuff, I was attacked for that... odd.

I put up a thoughtful sincere apology, and that wasn't enough... of course it wasn't... that wasn't the real agenda here. I told Mat that Friday that I would get a thoughtful post up on Sunday... he agreed... I did what was requested, after taking the time to Diagnose the problem and resolve to find the proper cure.

Mat came up with the proper cure... 15% of my posts are in the Mod forum... I got involved in too many things there. Exile (reading but not posting), was a way to reduce my involvement in areas where I disagreed with my critics. It was and still remains the most thoughtful and appropriate solution. Removing me from my forums, goes far beyond an appropriate solution... the "cure" does not fit the "diagnosis".



I was Frist'd with a rider to the Degen ban...

what started all this a couple of weeks ago? The difference in reaction to Did's post to Degen in ElD vs Mat's reaction to censored's post in ATF. This leading to Degen's banning and my de-greening and losing my forums, at the same time as I was (among other positive contributions) saving 800,000 posts from being lost... all I can say is, unbelievable.

I'm not the only one that thought Degen was a quality poster... interestingly, Degen appears on ElDiablo's list of experienced approved quality posters in ElD Forum. Nor was I the only mod to unban Degen last year.



I responded in the best way that I could, given the time constraints I was operating under. Berge best summarized the unreasonableness of the "respond now" crowd in this post.

My exact Self Exile post was reviewed and approved by Mat. Seems a little unfair to judge me on approved actions. He requested time to see if that worked, and imo, should have been given the time to see if it did.

The more serious question here may be, why aren't Mat's decisions being followed by Mods with longer Rap Sheets than mine. Mods who continually have negative threads about them in ATF. Who, as felicia pointed out, and I quoted in my apology post, engage in ModWars to the same extent if not greater than my participation, and in a nastier way. I am punished for adopting positions that have widespread support, but just from quieter mods and posters, who choose not to vocally get involved, for fear of being attacked in the way I have been.

If I had more time to devote to 2+2 while all this was going on, I certainly would have handled this a different way.



I still want to help in the ways I have, as well as initiating other projects I have been working on. My focus will also be working better with the other Mods, and being more focused on my productive dealings with the other active Mods, as well as with you.

I don't know what involvement you had in drafting "the proposal", but I was brought in late in that game. It is a good start that details some of how I will continue to help. But, as outlines in section 1 above, it is part of a three pronged approach I have taken to all of this. Which includes my continuing to fight for full reinstatement.

If we can find some common ground in all of this, then I would like to work with you on how best to move forward, to minimize the drama in the Mod forum.



to wrap this up...

I respectfully request that you give thorough thoughful consideration to all the things I've done here, regreen me and add me back to my 3 forums, and let's work together on the real issue of how I communicate with the few Mods that have an issue with my interactions in the Mod forum. If this was a situation, where another Mod took this action against me, I strongly believe that you would have overturned it, consistent with your past actions.

I recognize that my interactions with you in the past haven't been the best... I'm working on that... let's move forward together.

The past is the past (though I'm certainly willing to discuss it), it's time we got back to focusing on the Future!

Mat asked me (and reinforced it) when this started, to essentially start ForumWars... I declined as thinking taking this out of the Mod Forum wasn't the way to go, and I didn't really have the time to do it properly. Maybe an appeal to the posters is the way to go here, as I have received an increadible amount of support from them; maybe you'll give all of this due consideration and we can all get back to woking on improving the forums...

I await your thoughts on how to proceed in Mod!

[Sniper]

[ QUOTE ]
sniper,

not trying to be mean or cruel here, but i think most mods are totally ready to never think about your modding again. all that other stuff you want to do is fine, have fun. maybe if you took the time to post half this much stuff back when we were actually discussing it people would be interested in reading it; as is, TL;DR

[/ QUOTE ]

NT, I fully understand where you are coming from in saying this. I even raised it as an issue, that some of you wouldn't want to hear from me.

However, not only did the Admins request (almost demand) that I post, but there is a sense that some of the Mods do want me to post.

I am sorry that I wasn't able to give this more time a couple of weeks ago. I did the best that I could given my time constraints.

[[censored]]

sniper,

it seems like when you told El Diablo that you would not be demoded ragardless of what was posted here you had plenty of time to gather your thoughts and its only now after you were demoded that these new insights have come to you

[Sniper]

[ QUOTE ]
sniper,

it seems like when you told El Diablo that you would not be demoded ragardless of what was posted here you had plenty of time to gather your thoughts and its only now after you were demoded that these new insights have come to you

[/ QUOTE ]

[censored]

The frequently quoted statement I made to ElD is taken out of context. It was merely an attempt to frame my AIM conversation with him, in a way that was above the then current controversy. If my comments now, display growth from my comments then, maybe that's a good sign...

Since, ElD seemed to indicate he wouldn't have a probem with my posting that conversation, I am willing to do so. I will note that the conversation he initiated with me last night was far more productive than the conversation I had with him 2 Friday's ago.

[durron597]

sniper,

expect a much longer response from me when I have more time.

mat,

please don't do anything until i have written my longer response.

back to sniper,

however, my quick response is this: why do you want to be here, when it is clear that a large percentage of mods want you gone and another large percentage don't even care enough to take a position?